US Navy Band Euphonium Audition

[tubashaman2]

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[tubashaman2]

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[mclaugh]

You ignore that fact that the forum administrator, Sean Chisham and David Werden want to know as well. Still you go on with YOUR close minded attitude.

Well I guess I need to apologize for my total and complete honesty, but when BIG names, and they are big names (Sean Chisham and Dave Werden), are calling for some insight, maybe we should stop being so hard headed and listen to these REAL professionals.

The insight I would like to see may not be exactly the same as you are after. I would find it helpful if some generic points could be communicated directly from some members of the band. But that is not their policy. My main gripe isn't so much the silence but the way some musicians are treated when they publicly post something as benign as the audition date. The Navy Band is very strict.

And BTW, I did happen to speak to someone in the know about this audition and will just state it the way I heard it from the source.

No one played well.

And this person was sorely disappointed. I trust this person's opinion.

Geeeeee, relax a little!

Since my name has been used in some of the discussion above, let me pull a couple quotes from the post I made about this:

"I think it would be instructive for someone from the audition panel of the U.S. Navy Band to do a post with a summary/overview of the audition."
...
"But I'm also sure the committee did not hear something it needed to hear..."

I'm sorry if my tone was not clear, but I am not trying to say I have a right to the information or that I am starting some kind of quest to extract it. I was hoping to coax some information out of the band for what I think are good reasons, but I am very confident they have good reasons for not supplying it.

Damn, contraeuph, how's that taste? Gettin' whacked upside the head like that by two REAL professionals gotta hurt. Bet that's gonna leave a mark.

[dwerden]

For the record, it was not my intention to whack anyone - that wasn't the spirit of my post. The first line "Geeee..." was intended as light-hearted. Maybe I'll add a smiley!

[southerntuba]

A little insight would help for the people who are auditioning and for others who are thinking about auditioning so we know what the Navy band in specific is looking for.

Ryan, from what I gathered, that was answered here:

Questions or concerns can be addressed here: NavyBand.Auditions@navy.mil" target="_blank"

I'm amazed to see this expectation to give public comments/explanation after an audition....funny thing is that the demand usually comes from folks who weren't even at the audition. In the age of Blogs, YouTube and PodCasts, people seem to expect a discussion panel to be created after every audition so details can be discussed in the open (even with people who didn't take the audition). This is simply not the real world. An audition is not an exercise. It is not a competition. It is not a reality TV show. Comments about how candidates performed in an auditon are not meant to be "rumor-mill" material. They are private comments about how someone performed in a job interview. See below:

I have no interest in this audition past pure curiosity of who wins or makes it to another round.

I have a feeling this is 99% of the folks who contributed to this thread. The ones who auditioned are probably already back in the practice room.

Also, another point:

I am in agreeance for an experiment like Bopeuph said. Have one of the guys in one of the different DC bands audition and see what transpires.

Again, this is simply not the real world. An audition is a job interview...and the goal is always to hire someone. The goal is not to see if somebody with a job can advance to make sure the process is "fair".

Ryan and BobEuph, by their suggestion, seem to imply that nobody in the DC bands can play the requested excerpts well enough to advance at the Navy audition and that the audition panel/process is the problem. They wouldn't suggest this experiment be done if they honestly thought a DC band member could/would advance/win.

(If they believed a DC band member would/could advance/win, then what they are suggesting is that someone who is, as Ryan put it, "young with NO money" waste more money to come to an audition just so an experiment could be conducted....)

Did you guys even consider what would happen if your scenario were played out and the "ringer" won? Boy, then everybody would REALLY be angry.

Here's a counter to your proposal.....I would bet a lot of money that there are SEVERAL guys in DC who could play well enough to advance/win at that audition.


ST

[Chuck Jackson]

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

[tubashaman2]

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[TexTuba]

To everyone who has so far posted:



Here's to those who get it, those who are trying to get it, and to those who never really will.....

Ralph "The Douche when he wants to be" A.

[JHardisk]

I've always viewed the D.C. Navy Band euphonium positions as a few that should be/have been filled from the top ten-or-so players in the *world*...

To be clear, I'm certainly not a bloke basher. I think this point has been overlooked by many in this particular discussion.

One thing to remember is that this is the US NAVY Band. Last time I checked, all of the musicians in the ensemble are in the military. If all hell broke loose and poo hit the fan, and there was no other resort, it is the duty of these people to pick up arms and defend our nation. They all swore an oath of enlistment. It's always looming on a potential horizon, and is also forgotten.

Yes, this is a highly coveted musical position. However, they all went through basic training for a reason. The US military does not make a habit of hiring non US citizens.

That being said, the US Navy Band can do whatever they want in hiring. As with any field, you want to hire THE BEST person for the job. This has been said countless times on this discussion forum. This might also take things like personality, like-ability, and physical factors into account. (This is the military, and as musical ambassadors of the Navy, they have an image to uphold. As well, the chance of being asked to pick up arms is always a Very distant possibility.) This is not a union controlled job.

The Navy band WILL hire someone they think is best qualified. There WILL be countless great players that will keep coming back to audition. In the end, not everyone can ever be happy.

[southerntuba]

The "facts" being presented on this thread are quite humorous.

You can shoot me for saying this, and I may be totally wrong, however:

I would not be surprised when, at the end of all this, the winner of the audition process will share the same last name as the wonderful player who retired.

Ken F. 'realizing nepotism may be more common in the euphonium world than any of us realize'

Nepotism common in the euphonium world? Where? I can't even think of a parent/child relationship in the euphonium world period other than the Childs family. Also, generally when someone retires from a group they are not involved in the audition process for their chair (at least in an orchestra). Are you 100% sure the retiree is actually a voting member of the panel? If not, then why possibly discourage someone from taking the audition by suggesting conspiracy theories?

Last time I checked, all of the musicians in the ensemble are in the military. If all hell broke loose and poo hit the fan, and there was no other resort, it is the duty of these people to pick up arms and defend our nation. They all swore an oath of enlistment. It's always looming on a potential horizon, and is also forgotten.

I've heard this before and understand that those folks are in the military. However, can someone provide an actual instance where DC band members were asked to "defend our nation"? Keep in mind that those bands have existed longer than anyone on this board has been alive, during which time there have been many Conflicts/Wars MUCH more dangerous than anything we've seen in the last 20-30 years.


ST

[Lauronie]

You can shoot me for saying this, and I may be totally wrong, however:

I would not be surprised when, at the end of all this, the winner of the audition process will share the same last name as the wonderful player who retired.

Ken F. 'realizing nepotism may be more common in the euphonium world than any of us realize'

I get so infuriated when people throw stuff like this around. It is along the same lines as speculating that somebody got their gig because they were of a certain gender, race or studio.

WHAT IF the people who got their gigs actually worked really hard and earned them? HOLY CRAP. What if that actually happened??? What you are suggesting is that the Navy Band is not hiring somebody because they are waiting around for this particular person. That is the biggest load of bull crap I have ever heard. All of the rounds are screened at this audition. It was my understanding that the person being replaced is NOT on the panel. Do you actually think that an entire organization of some of the finest musicians in the country AND their officers give a damn about somebody's last name when they are trying to pick a musician to sit among their ranks for potentially 30 years. The idea is so insulting.

This isn't fair to the person you are talking about. If he does work hard and win a job, the people throwing this nonsense around are taking something away from him. It's not fair. I would guess that part of why the Navy Band is so tight lipped and careful about their auditions is to avoid any possibility of somebody accusing them of shenanigans. I've taken three Navy Auditions and every one of them was administered with an almost ridiculous amount of care taken to be fair and impartial as far as any factors were concerned apart from playing.

How many Navy auditions have you taken? How many military auditions period have you taken? Have you ever heard the person with the "famous" last name play? I have taken 3 Navy auditions, 7 military auditions, and I have heard that person play several times. So I am pulling experience rank here and telling you to SHUT IT!

Okay. I'm calm now. Promise.

[ASTuba]

You can shoot me for saying this, and I may be totally wrong, however:

I would not be surprised when, at the end of all this, the winner of the audition process will share the same last name as the wonderful player who retired.

Ken F. 'realizing nepotism may be more common in the euphonium world than any of us realize'

I get so infuriated when people throw stuff like this around. It is along the same lines as speculating that somebody got their gig because they were of a certain gender, race or studio.

WHAT IF the people who got their gigs actually worked really hard and earned them? HOLY CRAP. What if that actually happened??? What you are suggesting is that the Navy Band is not hiring somebody because they are waiting around for this particular person. That is the biggest load of bull crap I have ever heard. All of the rounds are screened at this audition. It was my understanding that the person being replaced is NOT on the panel. Do you actually think that an entire organization of some of the finest musicians in the country AND their officers give a damn about somebody's last name when they are trying to pick a musician to sit among their ranks for potentially 30 years. The idea is so insulting.

This isn't fair to the person you are talking about. If he does work hard and win a job, the people throwing this nonsense around are taking something away from him. It's not fair. I would guess that part of why the Navy Band is so tight lipped and careful about their auditions is to avoid any possibility of somebody accusing them of shenanigans. I've taken three Navy Auditions and every one of them was administered with an almost ridiculous amount of care taken to be fair and impartial as far as any factors were concerned apart from playing.

How many Navy auditions have you taken? How many military auditions period have you taken? Have you ever heard the person with the "famous" last name play? I have taken 3 Navy auditions, 7 military auditions, and I have heard that person play several times. So I am pulling experience rank here and telling you to SHUT IT!

Okay. I'm calm now. Promise.

Lauren,

Your points are valid. At the sake of trying to stop a pi**ing contest here......

Simple solution to all of this: just go practice and do better the next time.

That's all I have to say. Cheers!

[windshieldbug]

A thing that I remember being mentioned only once, and that candidates often overlook is STYLE.

Have they actually listened to the band enough to discern it's style of playing?

Are they even aware of it? Can they explain the differences between similar groups? Do they think that playing perfectly is enough? (can they even do that?)

This is a very specific, long-term relationship that the band is looking to form.

[lgb&dtuba]

The US military does not make a habit of hiring non US citizens.

Technically, that's not true. A foreign national with a green card can enlist. Citizenship is required, either by being native born or naturalized, for an officer's commission.
http://www.navy.mil/navydata/navy_legac ... et="_blank

[THE TUBA]

Keep it coming, guys.

[Wes Krygsman]

What I think is funny, is that the Navy band is getting all this flack and no one is really mentioning details about Detroit and Westpoint either, but no flack for them...not saying ANY of these groups deserve any crap for not taking anyone, just think it's funny we're so focused on one group. Good luck to all those auditioning in the future, may you all be so well prepared that they can't even narrow it down to finalists.

[TexTuba]

Here's what I find odd about all of this. During the election season, you have "analysts" who try and guess who's going to win what and where. During drafts, if you're a sports fan, you also have "analysts" who are paid to guess who is going where. If you watch ANY news at all, one segment is completely devoted to guesswork and speculation....weather. Now I am not going to type here and justify all of this...BUT.....guesswork and speculation goes on everyday, everywhere. Only people seem to get a little bent about this.

[TexTuba]

Here's what I find odd about all of this. During the election season, you have "analysts" who try and guess who's going to win what and where. During drafts, if you're a sports fan, you also have "analysts" who are paid to guess who is going where. If you watch ANY news at all, one segment is completely devoted to guesswork and speculation....weather. Now I am not going to type here and justify all of this...BUT.....guesswork and speculation goes on everyday, everywhere. Only people seem to get a little bent about this.

But Ralph, it is not news. It is a private job application process. Do you want "analysts" covering the various reasons that you failed to get the job as Sears and what you could have done better - on a worldwide forum? Do you really want that sort of personal/public scrutiny? And with the immaturity shown here in this thread you can guess that all your faults would be paraded around for all to "learn" from while everyone who likes you will defend you to the point of calling others very disgusting names and otherwise embarrassing you "in your defense" when finally a Sears employee ( "someone from who was present at your interview" ) comes on this forum to tell all your fans that you did not get the job because you failed to impress anyone enough to hire you? Do you think these candidates really want that sort of information on the WWW for these "classy" guys to toss around? It is embarrassing to have people continually bring up your failure, your PRIVATE failure.

It is not a sport. It is a job application process and it is private. It is not something you can purchase a ticket for, noting to which you eat popcorn and swill Coke.

"Analysts" are not what you call people who call others total douches and upload such photos. They will not handle such personal information and toss it about like a ball. I am so glad that you are not one of those "classy" guys who are only shooting themselves in the foot on a very public forum.

Stay cool, Ralph!

Wade

Once again, age and wisdom prevails. You are quite right.

Ralph "Still working to 'get it'..." A.

P.S.

When you coming to San Antonio?! Beer on me, Wade....

[TonyTuba]

Nethereuph: your point is well-taken, but I have two comments:

1. Roger Behrend was not the giant of the euphonium world that he is today when he won his job in 1984. Obviously, he was a very, very, very good player - I have heard him talk about his audition preparation, and of course, he already had a job. However, it would be foolish to argue that you do not continue to mature and grow as a player once you are in a professional position. You do not become a player like Behrend overnight, or even over six months of audition preparation. It takes a lifetime of maturation and experience to become the player he has become. If - and I am not saying that they are, I am saying if - the Navy Band is looking for someone who plays as well as or better than Roger Behrend in every respect right now, then they and we will continue to be sorely disappointed. The person does not exist, or at least is not currently taking auditions.
2. I respectfully submit (and hope - the comment seems uncharacteristically rude of him) that people such as I have mentioned at the audition were not who Doug Yeo had in mind when he referred to "John Doe from Podunk University School of Music."

I remember having a conversation with Doug Yeo on this topic, and he did not intend his remark to be rude, but it is realistic. The meaning is to let everyone know what they are up against in an audition, and yes, he was talking about all of you taking that audition. If he wasn't, that person would have been hired by now. You are playing to match Roger's standard, NOW. Its a tough deal, but that is what it is. Not only that, but the standard of everyone in the Navy band. Keep the faith, and keep trying the next time. Them not selecting a winner means the door is still open. Use it as a bonus. I do not think the Navy band euphs are thrilled at the prospect of extra funeral duties in the summer because the spot is open.

[Alex C]

If - and I am not saying that they are, I am saying if - the Navy Band is looking for someone who plays as well as or better than Roger Behrend in every respect right now, then they and we will continue to be sorely disappointed. The person does not exist, or at least is not currently taking auditions.

I enjoyed this comment. It reminds me of the CSO audition which went through several permutations without a "winner" being chosen, even though Mr. Jacobs had recommended several of the auditionees. He said that Solti told him they did not want the sound to change with the new principal tuba and Mr. Jacobs said something along the lines of: The sound will change and... you have to hire someone.

It worked out fine in the end and I think it will for the Navy Band too, when they come to that realization.