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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 12:55 pm
by UncleBeer
Lew wrote: With one rehearsal a week and about one concert every other month, that works out to about $3000 a year. Maybe I can retire from my IT job now. :)

DO IT!!! If you starve, then you're really an artist! :lol:

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:00 pm
by Matt Higgins
Lew wrote:I haven't been to any fancy conservatory (or any music school for that matter), but was recently offered a "paying" orchestra gig. It pays $55 per rehearsal and $75 per performance. With one rehearsal a week and about one concert every other month, that works out to about $3000 a year. Maybe I can retire from my IT job now. :)


What orchestra is it you were offered a job with? I'm actually from VA (Roanoke to be exact).

sorry...had to

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:04 pm
by james
"Young guys"-(and I include myself)....do not listen to these posts. I believe FOUR tapes were accepted to Cleveland this last audition. Some of these were students. Several tapes were also accepted to New York and Minnesota when they held auditions. Mike Roylance was someone who had to send a tape to Boston. Guess what, he won the gig. Orchestras DO listen to these tapes (about as much in detail as they do live auditions). They may sit down and read a newspaper or eat a sandwich while making a desicion of your playing in the first few seconds. That's not too different from what happens at a live audition. Would an unknown be able to handle the everyday pressures of an everyday top tier orchestra schedule? Maybe not right now. But audition success is a good way to get yourself invited to other auditions later WITHOUT having to make a tape. Yes, the path to a live audition is a lot tougher when you're in school. However, what better time will you have to "try your luck" with no one expecting you to do anything? Don't let what has been said here keep you from taking advantage of the best time in your life to learn how the audition process works.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:36 pm
by Drbuzzz
bloke wrote:
Tubadad wrote:I must say that my thinking has been swayed by those of you who view this as an opportunity for someone to be heard by a top tier orchestra committee, so I do now agree with the underlying philosophy of the glass being "half full."...I do agree that all aspiring players who want a shot should get a tape together asap or forever hold their peace.


Without fail, aspiring players end up "paying their dues"...

-They play in brass quintets that end up doing a bit of recording, touring, website boasting.
- They get jobs at colleges, play in $5000 - $10000/ yr. orchestras and play recitals.
- They work their way up into the Birmingham / Boise / Albuquerque / Colorado Springs / Tulsa / Chattanooga / etc. orchestra circuit.
- Eventually, large orchestras take notice and invite them to audition without asking for proof in advance that they can play the tuba.

This cycle (which generally commences once a player has been through $150,000 of conservatory schooling and [hopefully] free grad school at some state university) usually takes 10 - 15 years...some quicker, some slower, with many many others falling by the wayside and pursuing other (more lucrative) endeavors.


Hey, I resemble that chain of events!!

And to James, although I still consider myself a student (and always will), my CD was one of the four accepted last time. I just didn't want to see misinformation posted here.

Sorry to interrupt....continue the debate.
- Andy

oops

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:41 pm
by james
my post left out the words "some of" at the beginning of that sentence. Thanks Andy.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:08 pm
by MartyNeilan
bloke wrote:- They get jobs at colleges, play in $5000 - $10000/ yr. orchestras and play recitals.
- They work their way up into ... Chattanooga... / etc. orchestra circuit.


Hey Joe,

Chatty is sounding better than ever these days, but do you have any idea how little they pay?? It would be a step down!

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 8:47 pm
by Dan Satterwhite
They work their way up into the Birmingham / Boise / Albuquerque / Colorado Springs / Tulsa / Chattanooga / etc. orchestra circuit.


Of the orchestras you mention, all but Birmingham (and arguably the New Mexico Symphony...but I wouldn't want to have to live on $19K in any part of the country) are part-time orchestras that you really can't live on. The Alabama Symphony is a full time job that, while on the lower end of ICSOM salaries, pays a wage that you can live on, and make a comfortable career out of. The other orchestras, no matter how good they may be, would only be a part of a career that would need to include free-lance jobs and teaching to add up to a modestly comfortable living.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:06 pm
by SplatterTone
Birmingham / Boise / Albuquerque / Colorado Springs / Tulsa / Chattanooga / etc. orchestra circuit.

There is no longer a Tulsa P. O. I think it's just ad hoc, by the gig stuff now. But the Cains Ballroom is still in bidness. AND ... (Ta Da!) ... the mighty Fellowship Lutheran brass are still at it, Chinese tuba and all (or Czech tuba, wherever Allora 186 comes from). No pay, of course. I'm surprise they don't make us pay them to listen to us.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 7:13 pm
by sloan
Tubadad wrote:
...

My cynicism with the Cleveland audition has to do solely with inviting applicants who sent in resumes 2+ months ago to now send in a tape with less than 2 weeks notice - I am simply highly skeptical that anyone will actually get a 1st round invite, much less win the audition itself, as a result of sending in a tape under these circumstances.


I'm jumping in late here, but I have a point to make:

If you can't produce an acceptable tape of these excerts on 2 weeks notice, then you're not ready for the Cleveland job.

A serious job search should not be a lottery. It's not "come one, come all". Past performance *is* an indication of future success.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 7:40 pm
by sloan
Dan Satterwhite wrote:
...

The Alabama Symphony is a full time job that, while on the lower end of ICSOM salaries, pays a wage that you can live on, and make a comfortable career out of.

.


And many players do that. We had a minor hiccup in the 90's. but the ASO now appears to be on track (and sounding better and better every season). Now, if we can just get it over with and actually HIRE a Music Director... You think tuba auditions take a long time?

I tremble every time I hear the Cleveland is auditioning. I don't want to lose either Andy or Jay.

For Andy: do you know when the Samford music building is slated to open? I'm getting tired of walking down and up the stairs in Wright.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:43 pm
by Dan Satterwhite
Hi Kenneth:

So that's you that sits up in the first row of the balcony at Alys Stevens? When we played Brahms 2nd a couple of weeks ago, I turned to Andy and said, "Check it out...Brahms himself came to hear the concert!"

And now you do have a music director. I enjoyed playing for Justin Brown earlier this fall. How did you like him from the other side?

Dan

PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:03 pm
by sloan
Dan Satterwhite wrote:Hi Kenneth:

So that's you that sits up in the first row of the balcony at Alys Stevens? When we played Brahms 2nd a couple of weeks ago, I turned to Andy and said, "Check it out...Brahms himself came to hear the concert!"

And now you do have a music director. I enjoyed playing for Justin Brown earlier this fall. How did you like him from the other side?

Dan


Third row mezzanine (C121-3). Ask Jay to point me out.

Justin Brown was a good choice. Last year I was concerned about whether he was ready to give up his solo piano career. I thought it was a tactical error to conduct from the keyboard while auditioning for the MD job. But, everyone says that the players REALLY liked him. Let's see how long *that* lasts!

Did you have cimbasso-envy during the Siege of Corinth?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:06 pm
by sloan
Dan Satterwhite wrote:Hi Kenneth:

So that's you that sits up in the first row of the balcony at Alys Stevens? When we played Brahms 2nd a couple of weeks ago, I turned to Andy and said, "Check it out...Brahms himself came to hear the concert!"


oh yeah...the beard is much shorter now - UAB nurses shaved it off when I "died" last December. A beard is back - but I'm keeping it a bit shorter these days.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:35 pm
by Dan Satterwhite
Did you have cimbasso-envy during the Siege of Corinth?


Not a bit! That's my cimbasso that Andy was playing. He played it on La Forza del Destino Overture the week before, too.

In fact, in my avatar pic, I'm playing it onstage at Alys Stevens.

Come backstage and say hello sometime. I'll be back there in February for Tchaikovsky 4 and Beethoven 5.

Dan

PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 7:00 pm
by sloan
Dan Satterwhite wrote:
Did you have cimbasso-envy during the Siege of Corinth?


Not a bit! That's my cimbasso that Andy was playing. He played it on La Forza del Destino Overture the week before, too.

In fact, in my avatar pic, I'm playing it onstage at Alys Stevens.

Come backstage and say hello sometime. I'll be back there in February for Tchaikovsky 4 and Beethoven 5.

Dan


Aha! I thought you were watching Andy closely because you wanted to play it. Now I know you were watching the cimbasso to be sure Andy didn't drop it!

I missed the week before because I was in Phoenix. Actually, I heard the Phoenix Orchestra while I was there. I much prefer the ASO (or perhaps I just like Alys Stephens - it's a great place to listen, and a fabulous stage to play from).

I'll be playing on the AS stage this sunday - but I don't think it would be worth the trip to come and listen...

I'll try to catch you backstage in February, if I'm in town. I'm spending one weekend in Feb flying to Vancouver and back (what fun!)

PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 9:50 pm
by Lew
Hey guys, get a room. :lol:

Seriously Ken, it's good to see you back online. It seems like it's been a while since you've posted.

PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2005 8:41 pm
by Charlie Goodman
Is the "Andy" in question Dr. Miller? If so... dang. He can play a mean electric guitar.