Valve placement on Yamaha YEP321

dkrahl · Post by **dkrahl** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 8:23 pm

I'm really a tuba player, but I pick up my euphonium, a Yamaha YEP321, from time to time. I'm working on something for church that really isn't that difficult, but I'm having some problems with finguring. Its in D and I find that I am frequently going from b (2-4) to c# (2-3). However because the 4th valve is lower than the third valve, i have to twist my whole hand to make this transition. I could play the b as 1-2-3, but the intonation is not there. I've tried this on my rotary value BBb tuba, and its not a problem at all. Certainly if I work on this enough, I can make it work (and I'm getting it smoother), but why should it be more awkward on a euphonium than on a tuba? So my question is do I have a funny shaped hand (little finger too short perhaps?) or is this just an awkward design. I've never played any other euphoniums so, out of curioisity I would like to know if others would have this same problem.

Thanks for your comments

quinterbourne · Post by **quinterbourne** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 8:39 pm

Just as an experiement... try shifting your entire hand over one valve... so instead of alternating ring an pinky fingers, you are alternating middle and ring fingers. The pinky is an inherently weak finger, so that might help you a little. I'm not sure if a hand shift would be possible in the music, though.

Another option would be to bring the left hand up to help things a little. Might look strange, but could work.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:07 pm

The English style euphonium has a fourth valve which is off to the side, and used by the right hand for this reason. I use my right hand for 4th and 5th valve notes on the double bell pictured below.

In fact, I found 4 pistons so annoying, I made the fourth valve rotary on my flugelhorn, so that the key would be much more comfortable...

ken k · Post by **ken k** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 10:13 pm

see if you can pull your third valve tuning slide out a bit and make the 123 b sound a bit better in tune without throwing the 23 combination way flat? just a thought. It is a compromise either way, but sometimes you gotta do what ya gotta do..... you could try to pull the first valve slide out a bit too. just enough so it doesn't throw everything else out of wack, though.

ken k

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 10:34 pm

quinterbourne wrote: Another option would be to bring the left hand up to help things a little. Might look strange, but could work.

now THAT is why i love the 3+1

Rick F · Post by **Rick F** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 10:56 pm

If your problem is because the 4th valve is lower than the other 3, you could try building up the 4th valve button with something temporary like 3 or 4 dimes (not glue, but tape for testing). Just to see if this would help your fingering problem. This is along the lines of what Bloke was suggesting - but if you lengthened the valve stem, you'd create a problem with port alignment when the 4th valve is depressed. If you went this route, you'd also have to add some spacers or felts that the higher keybutton would bottom out on.

Just a thought.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sun Jun 04, 2006 11:04 pm

windshieldbug wrote:The English style euphonium has a fourth valve which is off to the side, and used by the right hand for this reason. I use my right hand for 4th and 5th valve notes on the double bell pictured below.

Well, there's always the Japanese British-style version of the 321, the YEP-621. Extremely hard to find in the US, however.

prototypedenNIS · Post by **prototypedenNIS** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 2:17 pm

quinterbourne wrote:Another option would be to bring the left hand up to help things a little. Might look strange, but could work.

that's how I did it anyway... your left hand pointer finger will alwys be faster than your right hand pinky (barring injury).

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 1:55 pm

All the more reason I play a three-valve compensator and live with my low E natural (Eb when I pull 3d slide) as my lower limit.

dwerden · Post by **dwerden** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 3:55 pm

Long ago a friend of mine had a similar compaint. He just cut some cork to match the diameter of the valve button and made it thick enough to provide the lift he wanted. Then he glued it to the pearl on top of the button. The advantage of the cork is that it is very light so it won't slow the valve down. Maybe someone could suggest a prettier and more modern material that is easy to work with, but I stay with something light-weight.

dkrahl · Post by **dkrahl** » Mon Jun 12, 2006 12:54 pm

Thanks for all of the advice. Undoubtably, the best option would be to get a horn that fits me better, but economics and the fact that its only this one piece of music that is creating any significant problems makes that inpractical. I have been working on this thing night and day and its getting much better. I think that it really has been a matter of strengthening my little finger. Perhaps the rotary valves on my tuba are a little too easy on me

I do like the idea of making the valve a little taller and may try that.

Dave

TubeNet

Valve placement on Yamaha YEP321

Valve placement on Yamaha YEP321

Lifting the 3rd Valve

Thanks!