Playing loud

[randy westmoreland]

I appreciate the kind words, but I am highly influenced by my studies at Northwestern University with Rex Martin, a Jacobs disciple, and by numerous recordings and videos and masterclass notes I studied while there. I may have butchered some of Mr. Jacobs teachings. The better teachers of this are direct students of Jacobs such as Rex Martin, David Fedderly, Floyd Cooley, and the like.

Yes. Rex Martin was the best teacher I have ever had. Very inspiring also. But remember: paralysis by analysis; the sound is most important. Hearing the sound you want, and what Sean first said about just spending a lot of time with louder dbs will give you most of what you are looking for.

[happyroman]

Dynamics on a brass instrument are partially (or predominantly) a function of the air speed; to play louder, move the air faster; to play softer, move the air more slowly.

However, as stated above, the air pressure should remain low. Think about blowing the air fast, but not blowing hard.

A good analogy is to think about a stringed instrument. To play louder, the bow moves quickly across the strings, but the player does not want to grind the bow into the strings.

The other point to keep in mind is to have a good concept of what you want to sound like, and strive to match the sound in your head.

A good model for this, to me, is Gene Pokorney. His sound never changes regardless of register or dynamic, it's always great. It's just like changing the volume on a great stereo. There's either more or less sound, but not altered sound.

Just a note to the statement I made above. Sorry, I did not mean to indicate that Gene's sound never changes at all, only that it is aways great, regardless of register, and especially, dynamic.

[Leland]

Would not the bore size have an influence on the amount of volume you would be able to "cleanly" produce?

There's a lot more to it than bore size. The King sousaphone I used in college (smallest valve section bore of all the tubas in the building) could get ridiculously loud without sounding broken, but my old .890" Zeiss Mirafone-look-alike would go bad at a significantly quieter volume.

I'll contest the point that Mr. Pokorny sounds the same at all dynamics in all registers. If the bell were aimed at you during, say, the Fountains Of Rome excerpt on his CD, you'd hear significantly more edge than in other, more mellow selections. It always sounds "great", definitely, but it's a different sound.

Anyway, part of what I think about achieving volume --

You can't do it without practicing it. You can't learn to sprint by walking, you can't learn calculus by reading a multiplication table, and you can't learn how to play loud by playing mezzo all the time. It takes time, fearlessness, intelligence (so your lips don't die), and privacy (even better for fearlessness... lol).

It also requires the player to learn the point at which the sound loses control & center. That way, he/she knows how to get to that fine line between Grand and Ugly, and not cross over.

[W]

ahhhhh, tuba players..........so dumb.

[W]

ahhhhh, tuba players..........so dumb.

[JB]

ahhhhh, tuba players..........so dumb.

..and your point was what, exactly??

[jbaylies]

ahhhhh, tuba players..........so dumb.

[Roger Lewis]

getting back to the original topic. Having, again, seen this on soooo many occasions, I would have to first ask - "which lip is doing the work?"

This has been a great discussion on embouchure efficiency. I have really enjoyed the learning experience. Another way to look at the embouchure function is as energy (the air), turned into work (the buzz). Neither the embouchure nor the air by itself produces the sound. It is a symbiotic relationship between the two that creates the sound (forget the horn - it's just an amplifier). This symbiotic relationship, though, is not equal. I have found that about 60% of the buzz sound on the mouthpiece and 40% of the air sound (the whistle you get through the stem of the mouthpiece when you just blow air through it) gives about the best sound with pretty good efficiency. Too much of either and the sound either gets too "grainyâ€

[windshieldbug]

If I may suggest, also think round inside your mouth, not forced and squeezed. The sound resonates within you, too, and when I want to sound "big" (not edgy), that's what I do.

[Art Hovey]

If you want to learn how to play loud, join a football band. You don't have to think about it, you don't have to take lessons, just blow enough to hear yourself over the drums. The techniques will fall into place. It does help to have a horn that is fat enough so it doesn't fight back.

[tubaguy9]

Any tips on playing loud, but with a good sound? The louder I get, the more edge the sound gets.
Thanks

Also, try that edge consistantly. No, not to actually make crap out of your sound, but rather to earn the embrosure(I spelled it wrong...I know). Try to use more bottom lip than top lip. Something that helps, is not letting the corners of the lips loosen. That's why it stars to get that edge. If that doesn't work, then it's the horn (I have experienced it...the horn overblows, and sounds bad...key is figuring out which it is...I learned that I can overblow a King BBb Contra at f, and a Yamaha BBb Contra at ff. A Dynasty GG I can't) I also found the (at least my opinion) dreaded sousaphone takes more...

[Tubaguy56]

well, speaking of horns and volumes, another thing to consider besides bore size is the thickness of the metal, the quality of the sound may also change depending on this and also the type of metal that is used to make the instrument. just a couple things to keep in mind.

my marching band just got a new line of souzy's that are clearly better instruments than the old line, but it seems that the old souzy's actually play louder. one of the most notable difference is the thickness of the metal. my gronitz pck also has INCREDIBLY thin metal, but I think this allows the metal to resonate more freely (a similar argument to laquer versus raw brass I think).