Longer tuning slide to lower the key of a tuba

vmi5198 · Post by **vmi5198** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 12:54 pm

I just had a thought... strange as it may sound, but I was wondering if anyone has had experience in making/purchasing a longer tuning slide to change the key of your tuba?

I have a 6/4 VMI 5198, and I like the idea of placing a longer tuning slide into the horn, and playing it as a Bb...

I have played Bb for years, but the reason I am asking this is because I like the sound quality of my VMI better than any Bb I have tried.

Now I realize that there may be some inconsistancies regarding intonation etc., but is this really a bad idea to consider?

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 2:40 pm

vmi5198 wrote:I just had a thought... strange as it may sound, but I was wondering if anyone has had experience in making/purchasing a longer tuning slide to change the key of your tuba? .........Now I realize that there may be some inconsistancies regarding intonation etc., but is this really a bad idea to consider?

I don't have any experience with the VMI horns but I can tell you first-hand what happens when you extend the tuning slide of a Miraphone 184 CC by the two feet it takes to drop the open note to BBb. The open note (now a BBb instead of a CC) is fine, as is the Bb in the staff. However, to do the job correctly, you also have to add quite a bit of tube length to the valve circuits. Some horns have enough 'pull' and some don't. At any rate, the 'CC' note on the now BBb horn as well as the 'G' went so far sharp that there was nothing I could do other than use alternate fingerings. I understand Miraphone had conversion slides for their 186 horns, but from what I've gathered, there were some intonation problems with them, too.
Like the previous poster said... if you want to play in a different key, get a horn that is manufactured with THAT key in mind.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 2:53 pm

The Getzen G-50/ CB-50 allowed one to lock the 5th valve so that it became in effect, a BBb instrument. From everyone I've heard about who tried it, the result was less than optimal. In fact, there WAS a BBb version of the CB-50, the CB-52, but they're not at alll common.

Doug@GT · Post by **Doug@GT** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 3:53 pm

Chuck(G) wrote:The Getzen G-50/ CB-50 allowed one to lock the 5th valve so that it became in effect, a BBb instrument. From everyone I've heard about who tried it, the result was less than optimal. In fact, there WAS a BBb version of the CB-50, the CB-52, but they're not at alll common.

I do this on mine when I'm preparing for marching season (so I don't learn "Ramblin' Wreck" with the wrong fingerings) and actually the result is quite good. The individual slides are long enough to compensate for the extra tubing, and I've not noticed any "bad" notes.

Anyway, does anyone know of a real, honest to goodness CB-52 in existence? I'd love to see one...

Leland · Post by **Leland** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 4:38 pm

This concept can be extended pretty far. Yamaha had slides available (all of them, main slide & valve slides) to drop their YBB-201M marching tuba from BBb down to GG for use in drum corps before the Bb rule was enacted for the 2000 season.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 10:29 pm

I posted on this subject earlier. Just for grins.... just to make sure.... I got out my spare Miraphone 183/184 tuning slides and my adapter slide and plugged 'em onto my 184 CC.... to give it one more try and hoping for the best since I would really like for the CC to be a BBb so it would be a little 'friendlier'. Nope! The intonation still sucks. The fact that I had VERY BAD intonation problems with the conversion slide on earlier trys was not just a fluke. The open bugle was OK but EVERYTHING ELSE had problems ranging from mild to out of control.

Leave the conversions to the manufacturers. The idea of adding long sections of straight-bore tubing to change keys just isn't feasible... unless you've got lots of time for R & D.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:17 pm

PhilW. wrote:Aside from intonation problems, the horn could sound stuffy due to less of a conical section and more cylindrical piping. Tying the fifth valve down might work better than extending the open bugle lead pipe.

What's the difference between adding cylindrical tubing in the fifth-valve branch and adding cylindrical tubing in the main tuning slide?

Rick "who thinks tubas are already designed to tolerate a wide range of ratios of cylindrical to conical tubing" Denney

Matt G · Post by **Matt G** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:56 pm

vmi5198 wrote:I just had a thought... strange as it may sound, but I was wondering if anyone has had experience in making/purchasing a longer tuning slide to change the key of your tuba?

I have a 6/4 VMI 5198, and I like the idea of placing a longer tuning slide into the horn, and playing it as a Bb...

I have played Bb for years, but the reason I am asking this is because I like the sound quality of my VMI better than any Bb I have tried.

Now I realize that there may be some inconsistancies regarding intonation etc., but is this really a bad idea to consider?

I used to own a 6/4 neptune CC.

I played in a Brass Band with it buy pusing the main slide all the way in and the fifth all the way in. I pulled out the valve slides accordingly and I used some well placed rubber bands to hold the fifth valve closed. It was in tune on the open BBb partials (just barely) and the scale was good enough for temporary use. Being as the fifth valve was a pretty bibg bore, it didnt feel too stuffy.

In BBb, I didn't really need the fifth valve.

This would be, by far, your cheapest alternative.

TubeNet

Longer tuning slide to lower the key of a tuba

Longer tuning slide to lower the key of a tuba

Re: Longer tuning slide to lower the key of a tuba

Re: Longer tuning slide to lower the key of a tuba