Valve Oil Concoctions

[Jay Bertolet]

Recently we had a brief discussion of one of my students' instruments and the valve oil that shipped with it. It was pointed out during that discussion that some (Alan Baer included) use/have used Lamp Oil in some mixture as an effective valve oil product. I'm curious to know what exact mixtures folks are using when doing this. I found the info on Alan's mixture (Lamp Oil + 1 drop of Mobil 1 5W30) but I imagine others have experimented with this sort of thing. If you're willing, please post your favorite valve oil mixture. This doesn't necessarily need to be limited to Lamp Oil. If you use other substances, please post those mixtures as well. The only restriction I'd prefer to put on this discussion is that I don't need a rundown of manufacturer products (Blue Juice, Hetmans, etc.) since I know most all of those personally. I'm primarily interested in mixtures that folks have developed themselves. Please feel free to include your assessment of why you like your mixture and what you think it does for you that other products do not. Thanks in advance for any info you provide!

[JCalkin]

I use ultrapure lamp oil and 3-in-1 and just "eyeball" the proportions. If you put a gun to my head, I'd say it's somewhere in the neighborhood of a 12-1 ratio.

I like it because it's as good as commercially available oils of the Al Cass style, but costs almost nothing.

The downside? 3-in-1 is stinkier than most commercial valve oils, but in this small amount it's not a problem, IMO. It's a small nit to pick, but for some reason I felt obligated to try and find a downside, no matter how insignificant.

[MikeW]

Plain lamp oil drains off of the pistons too quickly, so it needs a little thickening (but too much will slow the valves down). Personally, I'm not happy with the thought of inhaling fumes from automotive products, but medicinal-grade mineral oil should be safer (?). I tried neat medicinal mineral oil (the light grade, for external use), and the valves were smooth, but far too slow. Someone posted their recipe of 1 part mineral oil to 9 parts lamp-oil, and this seems to be working ok for me: I'm using ultra-clear smokeless lamp-oil, which is pretty much odourless.

If you want to add color, I believe you can use fat-soluble food coloring, as sold for coloring white chocolate (just don't let it drip on your clothes); normal food colors are water based, and don't mix with oil (I was curious, so I tried it).

If you want to add perfume, again it needs to be fat/oil soluble; I read somewhere that the stuff they sell for scenting candle wax should work, but I haven't tried it, so I don't know if it would leave any residue.

[iiipopes]

I use Roche-Thomas, and it doesn't wash away too quickly. When I play instruments with worn valves, I add a drop or two of mineral oil to an ounce bottle, then if that's not enough, a drop or two more. I've never had any issue with slow valves or lack of compression this way.

[MikeW]

anything labeled "valve oil" dumped on top of anything else labeled "valve oil" - whether petroleum-based or synthetic...

It is possible that BiNak may be an exception to the above:

I have seen posts (possibly not on this forum) that mention problems if BiNak is mixed with anything petroleum-based (including lubricants and some cleaning agents). In the worst case, the result was described as "mayo-like goop" on the pistons.

[cjk]

very similar to JCalkin:

lamp oil and singer sewing machine oil. I eyeball it. I just know what color it should be when I'm done mixing it.

[Euphtub]

Lamp oil and Marvel Mystrery Oil from the auto parts store.

The older the horn the more MMO.

[tofu]

I'd use M.M.O. - if no other reason - for the name alone.

Here I'll reveal the Mystery:

Composition of Marvel Mystery Oil (from a Jaguar site)

Ingredient # 01
Ingredient Name BENZENE, 1,2-DICHLORO-
CAS Number 95501

Ingredient # 02
Ingredient Name MINERAL SPIRITS
CAS Number 8052413

Ingredient # 03
Ingredient Name NAPTHENIC HYDROCARBONS
CAS Number 64742525

[Roger Lewis]

Back in my days at Mannes, one of the trumpet players was using a home brew of deodorized kerosene mixed with oil of peppermint. I don't recall the proportions but a little experimentation would probably create something usefull. The peppermint helped get rid of the kerosene fumes.

Roger

[Donn]

Composition of Marvel Mystery Oil

Ingredient #04 - something red
Ingredient #05 - something real smelly, vaguely like wintergreen

I wish it could be a mystery again. The stuff tends to leak out when the bottle falls over, too.

I like whatever random motor oil, the few drops that can be extracted from used bottles, mixed with lamp oil of course, but most of my stuff has rather loose tolerances.

[Donn]

[tofu]

NAPTHENIC

I love it when you talk dirty.

Watch it thar Slick Willie.

Don't you be gittin yer self all lubricated up.

We don't take kindly to fellas like you wearing them thar saggy pants in these here parts.

Don't make me reveal that thar mystery of what yer really full of

[Art Hovey]

If it's true that MM oil contains benzene then I would avoid it; benzene is carcinogenic.

I tried kerosene many years ago. It smells like kerosene, and it leaves a gummy residue after it dries out. I imagine that heavier oils like STP and motor oil might do the same thing.

A few years ago I read here that Al Baer suggested adding a little "break-free gun oil" to his ultra-pure lamp oil. I found some at our local gun store. It's similar to sewing machine oil and odorless, although apparently dogs can smell it. If you mix enough gun oil in with your lamp oil to make the pistons slightly sluggish and then put in more lamp oil until they feel right then you have the right mixture for your pistons. On some older instruments the gun oil works well without dilution.

When pistons do get gummed up a little dose of "Goo-Gone" from Homey Depot or "Formula 409" works wonders.

[MikeW]

If it's true that MM oil contains benzene then I would avoid it; benzene is carcinogenic.

I wondered about that too. The ingredient is actually listed as 1,2 DichloroBenzene (ie. not just "Benzene"), and its MSDS doesn't mention carcinogenicity. On the other hand, it has been used in forestry as a large-scale insecticide, which may be worth a thought.

If you mix enough gun oil in with your lamp oil to make the pistons slightly sluggish and then put in more lamp oil until they feel right then you have the right mixture for your pistons. On some older instruments the gun oil works well without dilution.

At one time, you mentioned experimenting with Glycerin as a lubricant. How did that work out ? I seem to remember being told that a lubricant that was popular in Britain in the eighties was actually just Glycerin and water. It seemed to dry out very quickly.