Boosey and Hawkes "Imperial" Tuba Project?

[roughrider]

While rummaging around in our band storage area, I came across a Boosey & Hawkes "Imperial" 3 valve BBb tuba. The horn has several leaks and the finish is in very poor condition. Someone tried to clean the silverplate by putting a caustic chemical on the surface and all it did was stain the top of the horn black with lines leaking down the bugle. I would guess that the horn is about 50-60 years old and it came to our band in a trunk case all the way from England. The normal ball at the bottom of the bottom bow is there and there are several small dents and marks. What is the consensus about these horns? Would this horn be worth putting elbow grease and some money into or should our tuba section leave it alone? Opinions welcome!

[Ulli]

Can say, my silver plated Boosey&Hawkes Imperial BBb, 3v comp. with 17" bell, is heavy like a tank, unergonomical designed (in spite of missing emasculate knob), with very strong valve springs- but sounds GREAT. And I need a Dennis Wick mpc without letter (1 or 2) ,but my SSH with American shank fits just as well.

[iiipopes]

About as perfect intonation as exists on tuba, if you are willing to settle on low E 1+2+3 as the bottom of your range, and a stuffy note here and there.

Have a good tech resolder all the joints, add a small dent in the knuckle between the 1st valve and 2nd valve primary ports so the 5th partials will be better in tune, and go for it!

[eeflattuba]

Our brass band owns an e flat imperial tuba and it is a fine horn. Not pretty to look at but it does play really well.These are good tubas, an ergonomic nightmare to play, but very solid with good pitch and tone. I would not be too concerned of how it looks but more how it plays. I have played a number of these over the years and i have yet to find a bad one. The fact that it has only three valves is not a bad thing.Most concert band literature that your band plays rarely goes below the concert f. Play it at your next rehearsal, i think you might be suprised. GOOD FIND!!

[roughrider]

Thank you for all of the replies. I found the "kosikup" mouthpiece and plugged it in for a short play. The sound was full and round and the pitch for a fifty year old horn was very good indeed. The springs are very strong and the valves after a short dunk in oil were smooth. I brought the horn home and applied silverplate polish to the finish. The tarnish came off of the horn in chunks onto the micro-fiber cloths that I used. After five hours I took a break for the rest of the day! It is not complete yet however it seems that the finish will end up being very bright. I think another several hours of work and the tuba will look great. I am taking it to my local technician for a dip in the electro-sonic tank and hopefully this horn will join the active list at the band hall. Having it there means I do not have to haul a tuba for two different rehearsals per week and that is just a bonus as well!

[tofu]

Would this horn be worth putting elbow grease and some money into or should our tuba section leave it alone? Opinions welcome!

I bought the Besson New Standard version of this used back in 1981 when the horn was 10 years old. Yeah - they are built like a tank, heavy and the guy who was in charge of design ergonomics must have been on LSD. With today's light/cheap playing stands it's easy to hold & play. The upside - wonderful unique sound, best intonation you will find on a tuba, nimble, singing high range and excellent low range, notes slot very well, fast valves, sound won't break up at high volume, projects like crazy and blends so well with trombones/euphs.

I had mine completely rebuilt and that has given the horn the false tones necessary for low Eb. Mine isn't stuffy in the low range like these sometime are, but you do need to understand that the approach is different from a super free blowing horn. Not hard to master. Besson/Boosey had a roller coaster ride over the years with build quality so some of the problems some of these horns suffer from are due to that and not design. Valve alignment & mouthpieces are important to this horn. I use an old style Wick 1, Wick 2 and a modified Schilke 67 that I had Schilke build me back in the early 70's. I'd recommend you have a good repair guy give it a bath, roll out the dents, check for leaks, have the ball buster removed, have the valves aligned and new felts corks etc. and buy a BBC playing stand. If you want to improve the bad silver look you could strip it to bare brass. You will then have a really nice tuba that may not be "in fashion" but will be a real player for not a huge outlay of cash.

I bought mine when I had no money after college and since then I've bought several nice horns, but every time I think about selling it I play it and remember what a nice horn it is so 30 plus years later I still can't part with it.

add a small dent in the knuckle between the 1st valve and 2nd valve primary ports so the 5th partials will be better in tune

I know this worked great for this poster, but I'm not so sure I'd be doing this before I had the horn worked on and played it. My own horn never suffered from this 5th partials issue so I wonder if it was just this particular instrument that had this issue. If I recall I believe he had a different sized bell on it.

[eeflattuba]

Thank you for all of the replies. I found the "kosikup" mouthpiece and plugged it in for a short play. The sound was full and round and the pitch for a fifty year old horn was very good indeed. The springs are very strong and the valves after a short dunk in oil were smooth. I brought the horn home and applied silverplate polish to the finish. The tarnish came off of the horn in chunks onto the micro-fiber cloths that I used. After five hours I took a break for the rest of the day! It is not complete yet however it seems that the finish will end up being very bright. I think another several hours of work and the tuba will look great. I am taking it to my local technician for a dip in the electro-sonic tank and hopefully this horn will join the active list at the band hall. Having it there means I do not have to haul a tuba for two different rehearsals per week and that is just a bonus as well!

Good plan. While it at the repair shop[kevin junk's, i presume] get him to to put a larger mouthpiece receiver on it. It will really open up the horn and give you more mouthpiece options. Also have him cut off the bottom ball.

[iiipopes]

Add a small dent in the knuckle between the 1st valve and 2nd valve primary ports so the 5th partials will be better in tune.

I know this worked great for this poster, but I'm not so sure I'd be doing this before I had the horn worked on and played it. My own horn never suffered from this 5th partials issue so I wonder if it was just this particular instrument that had this issue. If I recall I believe he had a different sized bell on it.

No, you're thinking of my 186 that has both the separate upright and forward detachable bells. As far as the "dent" goes, well, maybe it could have just been my particular Besson New Standard 3-valve comp from @1971, so maybe the "dent" is not a good idea. But now I know at least someone was actually reading my posts. And actually, I'm having a Besson bell put on my 186 since I now have a souzy and I don't need the forward bell anymore.

[roughrider]

These are all excellent comments and suggestions that have been made. The main issue with going ahead is that the horn belongs to the band and is not my personal tuba. I will need to present this plan to the board and ask their approval before going ahead. I would doubt that there will be any opposition and as well, I am planning to pay for the work myself. The board meets this week and I will hope for the best.

[Ulli]

Can say, my silver plated Boosey&Hawkes Imperial BBb, 3v comp. with 17" bell, is heavy like a tank, unergonomical designed (in spite of missing emasculate knob), with very strong valve springs- but sounds GREAT. And I need a Dennis Wick mpc without letter (1 or 2) ,but my SSH with American shank fits just as well.

addendum to my Imperial: It's from 1931 (time between Boosey&Co and Boosey&Hawkes), frozen silver finish and with a wondefull flower engraving.
Ulli

[roughrider]

The "Imperial" came out of its trunk this evening. It performed very well indeed. All of the comments made by the previous posters about the qualities they felt the horn has were true. The pitch and tone and range were great. This is a horn that I will continue to try and improve and it will be my go to horn for at least one of the bands I play in. Tomorrow night, I will put it to the test with "Molly On The Shore' by Grainger and "Symphonic Dance No.1" by Rachmaninoff as well. A Good Find Indeed!!

[roughrider]

The "Imperial" joined the rehearsal tonight and I was very pleased with it. The greatest characteristic of this horn is its ability to blend with the rest of our brass section and the band. It slotted very well and provided a strong and clear tone with notes that were in tune and sonorous. A little bit of messing around in that band storage room has produced a great horn that I will be happy to use at our rehearsals instead of hauling one from home. Now, If I could only find a BBb
King, Conn or Holton sousaphone in there! Thanks for all of the help provided by the posters here!