One of "those" questions...

greatk82 · Post by **greatk82** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 11:42 am

("Somebody open up a window!")

Tom · Post by **Tom** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 2:39 pm

TubaTinker wrote:
Tom wrote:What about using easy-off oven cleaner?
Easy-Off is a caustic product. It will work on the orange King lacquer but not on most other lacquers. Try Aircraft Stripper first. If that doesn't work, then you might try the oven cleaner.... but be warned... after using caustic you're going to have to buff your *** off to get rid of the black that it leaves behind.

Good to know.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 3:54 pm

tuben wrote:....We would coat every inch of exposed skin with the spray Deep-Woods-Off. After a few shows I noticed the lacquer where my right arm rested on the bell looked funny, kind of scaly like a fish. I scratched it with my thumbnail and viola, the lacquer flaked right off and only left the bare brass below. No black gunk, no residue, nothing. .....

According to the MSDS, Deep Woods 'OFF' contains 30-60% (by weight) Ethanol. I had a similar experience a few years back where I was wearing a bunch of Mardi Gras beads and OFF at the same time. The OFF darned near disolved the beads and made a heck of mess on my T-shirt. Off will also mar the surface of things like watch crystals and cell phones. There may be something else besides Ethanol in there, though.... Ethanol is just alcohol and it doesn't seem to me that that should cause problems with lacquer.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:41 pm

trseaman wrote:djwesp,

I was going to ask you... So since we're talking about NEB and ARK and rednecks! Where are you located now and where were you located in ARK? I've got some family in northern NEB and family all over NW ARK & SW MO... So, I moved to OK because there are no rednecks out here!!!

Okay everybody you can stop laughing anytime now!!!

Tim

Central Nebraska now.

Was raised in North Central Arkansas in a Retirement town full of people from Chicago (Mountain Home, Arkansas). Which is the trout capital of the world (Cotter) and is surrounded by the Bull Shoals Lake, Lake Norfork, White River, and the Buffalo River. You literally can't get in without crossing some body of water. It is a beautiful area of the country. (pic below from my drive home from school)

Pretty Scenic for a town and area as big as it is (about 40,000 in the county-- about three hours from the nearest legitimate airport) and about 2 miles from the Missouri Border (about 45 miles from West Plains, Missouri and about an hour and a half from Branson, Missouri). I'd love to still live there, but it takes forever to get anywhere. The roads in and out of the place are 45 MPH and as curvy as heck.

Then went to college at Arkansas Tech University in Russellville, about an hour away from Little Rock/ 40 minutes from Conway, Arkansas.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:10 pm

Scooby Tuba wrote:
TubaTinker wrote:I had a similar experience a few years back where I was wearing a bunch of Mardi Gras beads and OFF at the same time.
I just want know what you did for the ladies to garner all those beads!!!

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:13 pm

Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn. Most all lacquers are a real bear to get off after it is heated to the point of discoloring.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:19 pm

TubaTinker wrote:Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn. Most all lacquers are a real bear to get off after it is heated to the point of discoloring.

Here's what I was going to do.

1. Remove all wear items on the horn. Felts, corks, valves, etc.

2. Clean the horn out really well with boiling water, removing all water, humidity, chunks of crud with compressed air.

3. Test the remover on spot between second and third valve (where it won't be seen).

4. Remove all slides, individually remove coating. Then remove coating from remaining instrument.

5. Cleaning the horn with hot water and calcium carbonate after the removal.

6. Drying and buffing the horn, removing all the black. Using a buff pad on a speed variable dremel and a hand buffer to remove from hard to reach places.

7. Apply Jax.

Does that sound okay?

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:19 pm

djwesp wrote:
TubaTinker wrote:Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn.

Here's what I was going to do. ......Cleaning the horn with hot water and calcium carbonate......

I've heard of calcium carbonate (whiting) and alcohol being used to clean satin silver finishes but I'm not sure what purpose it would serve to clean a raw brass horn. Please elaborate.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:39 pm

I'm going to catch heck for this, but if you're going to patinate the horn anyway, you could just skip the buffing and use some 0000 steel wool. It'll bring the horn to a nice soft shine without scratching--and remove any little bits of lacquer that the remover didn't get.

And forget the calcium carbonate. Get a bucket of warm water and some dishwashing detergent and one of those plastic pot scrubbing pads.

If you want to buff to a jewel shine, then get one of these and prepare to get dirty:

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 11:19 pm

TubaTinker wrote: I've heard of calcium carbonate (whiting) and alcohol being used to clean satin silver finishes but I'm not sure what purpose it would serve to clean a raw brass horn. Please elaborate.

Was told at the Pueblo Chemical and Supply (the local supply store) that Calcium Carbonate serves to effectively eliminate the caustic qualities of the stripper, as it is basic.

Could be wrong, only going by what they said. They said it would serve to prevent any chemical burns to myself or anyone in the future that was using the product if I missed any spots when "rubbing" the horn.

(who is taking a lot of stock into what everyone is saying, so please... correct me if I'm being informed wrong)

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 11:57 pm

djwesp wrote: Was told at the Pueblo Chemical and Supply (the local supply store) that Calcium Carbonate serves to effectively eliminate the caustic qualities of the stripper, as it is basic.

That might hold some truth if the stripper was in a water base, but aircraft stripper is nothing more or less than methylene chloride, most of which evaporates within about an hour or so. Detergent and water should do the trick for cleanup--but read the directions on the jug to be sure.

Keep the stripper away from your skin (it can cause a burning sensation) eyes, rubber, plastic, painted surfaces--you get the idea.

Oddly, that's not the nastiest stuff. I conferred with an expert on how to remove that orange King lacquer. He suggested vinyl pyrrolidine. I read the MSDS on the stuff and decided that I'd pass.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sun Mar 11, 2007 12:04 am

Chuck(G) wrote: Detergent and water should do the trick for cleanup--but read the directions on the jug to be sure.

Easy enough.

Yeah, I've had chemical burns before. Definitely going to be careful enough to avoid that.

I'm wondering why they would tell me that? When I get the stripper I'll double check to make sure my active ingredient is in fact methylene chloride, then follow your instructions.

If the active ingredient is something else, I'll come back and consult the Chuck/TubaTinker jury.

Or should I try to ensure that the m.c. is the active ingredient and buy accordingly?

tubeast · Post by **tubeast** » Sun Mar 11, 2007 6:58 pm

IÂ´d say the best and only authentic way to get patina on a raw brass horn is - use it.
Let the playerÂ´s sweat do the work.

Honestly, I truly believe there is beauty in traces of regular use on a professionalÂ´s tool (any tool, that is). That includes, for example, scratches from wedding rings or shiny spots where a sleeve rubs and polishes the horn.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sun Mar 11, 2007 7:02 pm

tubeast wrote:Honestly, I truly believe there is beauty in traces of regular use on a professionalÂ´s tool (any tool, that is). That includes, for example, scratches from wedding rings or shiny spots where a sleeve rubs and polishes the horn.

Hmm... You know, when the letters wear off of my keyboard, I toss it and get another one. Of course, they don't build 'em like they used to (double-shot keycaps)...

tbn.al · Post by **tbn.al** » Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:13 pm

All this talk about strippers and professional's tools makes me wonder where this is going.

TubaRay · Post by **TubaRay** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:35 pm

tbn.al wrote:All this talk about strippers and professional's tools makes me wonder where this is going.

Don't get you hopes(or anything else) up.

tubatooter1940 · Post by **tubatooter1940** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 9:45 pm

tubeast wrote:IÂ´d say the best and only authentic way to get patina on a raw brass horn is - use it.
Let the playerÂ´s sweat do the work.

Honestly, I truly believe there is beauty in traces of regular use on a professionalÂ´s tool (any tool, that is). That includes, for example, scratches from wedding rings or shiny spots where a sleeve rubs and polishes the horn.

I like Hans' historical perspective. I find belt buckle scratches on the back of a used guitar, evidence of real use on any musical insrument interesting and affirming.

tbn.al · Post by **tbn.al** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:47 pm

[quote="TubaRayDon't get you hopes(or anything else) up.[/quote]

Hopes are just about all I got left!

TubeNet

One of "those" questions...

One of "those" questions

Re: One of "those" questions