Tuba in jazz band (as a horn, not string bass)?

[tubaguy9]

Some of the Stan Kenton charts have tuba on the bottom.

My personal opinion on this is to play tuba on the charts that call for tuba, and play a real bass trombone (with a bass trombone mouthpiece!) on the majority of charts that call for bass trombone. Yeah, tuba can play the notes, but it's about timbre.

Exactly. Some can be range, too. I remember this last year going to jazz competitions playing one of Ellington's Congas (I can't remember the name of the tune, if someone named it, I would recognize it. It was like half note=132...We had the Essentially Ellington version, so it had 3 parts), A ballad made famous by one of the big-bands (I'm really bad at remembering piece names right now), Opus 4, and Bugle Call Rag. Bugle Call rag was written for a Jr. High band, I think, or 4-part tenor 'bone 'band, but I remember carrying 4 instruments to each competition: Tuba, Bass 'Bone, and Tenor 'Bone. Tenor 'Bone on the Ellington, Bass Bone on the ballad (it called specifically for the bass) and Bugle Call (once in a while transposing octaves for fun) and then Tuba on Opus 4...All with appropriate mouthpieces...

[ken k]

gil evans/miles davis stuff on Miles Ahead, Sketches of Spain, Porgy & Bess and Birth of the Cool.

Do a search on you tube and you will find some great videos.

They are all posted on my favorites list!

k

[eupher61]

Mel Torme' wrote tuba parts for about 60% of his charts. Good writing, great performer (RIP), and genuinely good person.

The Akron U big band used tuba back when...check out www.notachancetofindone.com

And, not a big band, but Gravity! uses a tuba in a non-bassline setting, don't they?

[LoyalTubist]

The late Bill Barber was considered to be the first real jazz playing tubist who didn't have to play the bassline.



Bill Barber

The first band of the popular music genre to hire a tuba player in that capacity was Harry James. Kay Kyser had a tuba player before him, but he basically played a stylized bassline. The same could be said about Sammy Kaye.

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Harry James




Kay Kyser



Sammy Kaye

And, for what it's worth, the first tuba player who became nationally famous (because he was a radio star) was Country Washburn. Actually, he was the tuba player and singer for Ted Weems, as well as the band's arranger. Later, he would play (and arrange) for Spike Jones. After leaving Spike, he was a staff arranger and bandleader for CBS at Columbia Square in Hollywood.

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Joe "Country" Washburn

Two of these pictures from the Gulf Coast Museum in Texas could not be posted on this page. The links will work fine.

[Richard Armandi]

Bob1062 wrote:
Earl McIntyre played what looked to be a 3+1 comp Eb tuba....

Earl played my Yamaha 381 (it has a dependent 5th in the 4th valve tubing, pitched at a flat whole-step). I rented it to the festival for his use.
Mine was the 2nd prototype (Bob Bauchens got the 1st one) way back in 1984. A superb instrument!

[Sean Greene]

A couple of great commercial recordings with tuba 'as a horn' in the ensemble:

Wes Montgomery - (I think it's) "Movin' Wes" has Harvey Phillips reading some great lines.
The Dominic Spera Big Band CD, I forget the actual name of the CD, includes Dan Perantoni on tuba. That's a slammin' disc as well.
The Basie 'n' Brass album with all those Quincy Jones arrangements. I remember really enjoying that.
Oh, and Howard Johnson playing with the Thad Jones/Mel Lewis big band- I think it's on "Consummation". Awesome band, awesome tubist.
Recordings featuring Howard Johnson, David Bargeron and Jim Self should be sought out, too.

Hope this gives some direction to your listening.

SG

[TonyZ]

Here in Columbus, we have the "Famous Jazz Orchestra" of Vaughn Wiester. This group has an integral tuba part that double on 4th bone. As Vaughn played in Woody's band, there are many charts from there as well as Basie, Kenton and others. Vaughn is very close with Bill Holman, so there are many of his charts. The tuba in an integral voice, sometimes playing the tune 1 octave below the lead, or filling out harmony, but never as the rhythmic bass voice nor doubling it. It is a very cool sound, and the charts are all great. I am not his regular player, but I sub frequently. You have to play tenor bone, which makes the gigs daunting for some. If you are ever around, the band plays every Monday night at the Columbus Music Hall from 7:30-11:00pm. I will be on the band this Monday, September 10. Cover is $5 and parking is free. The music is phenomenal, and the book is about 450 charts. All good stuff!

http://www.columbusmusichall.com/

[LoyalTubist]

The first jazz band to use the 5th Trombone/Tuba designation was, in fact, Stan Kenton's. This goes back to 1962. The late Tommy Johnson was probably the first regular tuba player who doubled on bass bone (on the same gig) in the Hollywood studios a few years before this. Most tuba players prior to him doubled as bass players, if they doubled on anything at all.

[David Spies]

There are bands that have used tuba in the horn line. Many have mentioned Kenton, the Gil Evans Orchestra (great voicing with tuba/bari sax in fifths!) and others.

We have a big band in Madison that uses tuba in the fifth bone chair, the separate tuba chair, and, on occasion, in place of the bari sax when he can't make it up from Rockford.

The Madison Jazz Orchestra (http://www.madisonjazzorchestra.com) is pretty active in the region, having been featured at Madison's Overture Hall, the Isthmus Jazz Festival, and concerts throughout Wisconsin and Illinois.

We are part of a small but very vibrant jazz community here in Madison, with Richard Davis, Roscoe Mitchell, Joan Wildman, Les Thimmig, several big bands, traditional and dixieland jazz, and small jazz combos. The Isthmus Newspaper regularly features jazz listings (http://www.thedailypage.com/music/). It is possible nearly any night of the week to go listen to great live jazz. It is very encouraging in that regard.

We have a regular twice-monthly gig at a local bar called the Harmony Bar and Grill. However, our other monthly location, Rusty's, a venue that has featured live music for over 50 years, just announced (as did two other local jazz venues the very same day) that it will be going out of business (though this was mainly due to road construction nearby). They are talking about replacing the club with a convenience mart.

Jazz in any manner is a delicate endeavor in smaller markets. Encourage your local audiences to listen to all types of live music, including jazz, and to support local establishments that continue to present live music in your own communities. It's too important!

David Spies
Madison Jazz Orchestra
Racine Symphony Orchestra
Willson Tuba Quartet

[JohnMCooper]

I use my 184 often in a big band setting. Yes, I use it on charts that have tuba parts written, but I will also use it on ballads (not all of them, it has to fit). I find that the 184 blends real well with the bones while adding a nice bottom.

[neil]

I played in Phil Wilson's big band while I was at Berklee; he had many charts with specific tuba parts. He also adapted some arrangements to write the tuba in and it always filled it out nicely without mirroring the bass or bass trombone. I remember him saying that he had always loved the sound of tuba in big band.

The late Tommy Johnson was probably the first regular tuba player who doubled on bass bone (on the same gig) in the Hollywood studios a few years before this. Most tuba players prior to him doubled as bass players, if they doubled on anything at all.

As a freshman at USC I asked Tommy if I should take up bass as a double and he recommended learning trombone instead. It turned out to be a great suggestion where I've been able to do exactly what you say, play tuba and bone on the same gig.

[dopey]

I've played in jazz bands on tuba, usually Kenton stuff, one piece that comes to mine is Rainy day(or something like that).

I do prefer playing Dixieland though..