Interesting Photo

[TonyZ]

Three cheers for ingenuity!!! I think the Wright Flyer is ugly, too!!

[Dylan King]

The thing looks stupid. How would you carry it around. And you can forget about having a gig bag.

Now that I am sober, I think it looks cool.

[TonyZ]

Good sobriety timing--the game just finished!

[Dan Schultz]

Here's the question for Dan Schultz and Rick Denney (and all you other engineers):

Why do you think a tuba was designed the way that it looks now?

My opinion of why ANYTHING is manufactured the way it is goes something like this:

The material and configuration of any product is what it is because that is the most economical way for the product to be made. It doesn't matter if you are making toasters or tubas. The same rules apply. Regarding quality... That's the level drawn by what the customer will tolerate and still buy the product.

[Cameron Gates]

How would you stand to play the national anthem? Big flaw.

Other than that, I would love to try that thing. It would be nice to hear exactly what comes out of the bell. In my case I would hear a lot of fuzz and uncentered notes I am sure. It would be a great practice/self teaching instrument.

Did anyone else notice the cimbasso on the floor next to him? MMMM.... cimbasso.

[Chuck(G)]

How would you stand to play the national anthem? Big flaw.

I think your statement goes a long way toward explaining the current state of the shape of tubas. Made for bands and not orchestras. People stand and march in bands.

I've always wanted a tuba that's shaped like a straight contrabassoon, tall, with the bell pointing outwards and downwards.

How about this tuba:



or this one:



or this one:



Why should everyone have to play an instrument with carriage rings?

[MaryAnn]

So a Sousaphone isn't stupid looking? Nor a Cimbasso??

It doesn't look STUPID, it looks DIFFERENT.

Yeah, isn't it amazing the knee-jerk reactions people have to anything that isn't what they've seen the last elbendy seven years?

Oren has a particular interest in new playing techniques. One of the photos in this thread show some hosepipes in the shot. If I've got this right Oren takes the valve slides out of the 'main tuba' and adds lengths of hose, each attached to another tuba somewhere in the room. The differing lengths of hose effectively make the 'remote' tubas in a variety of keys when the corresponding valve is pressed. Oren uses this technique for performance and the results are quite remarkable.

Bravo Oren for thinking outside the norm!

I saw a comedy routine in which a horn player did this....ran hoses from his valves to people holding funnels (on the ends of the hoses) and did some really raucous things! It would be very curious to try it with an entire instrument on the other end.

MA, who had the "engineer reaction....KEWL!"

[Hank74]

I have come up with a name for this great invention that I'd certainly like to try one day. The orenophone.

As one who usually plays the sousaphone, I'm still trying to get used to playing a regular sitdown tuba with the right posture. This orenophone might help out future peformers who want to play the tuba but don't have the build to do so.

I've always thought about how would a BBb tuba would look like without all the wrappings that goes with it. This is a good indication. Whether it has a straight bell or curved one, I like this design. The only thing though I would suggest is to have it divided into different parts, like the sousaphone, so that it can be carried easily in a bag. I say this so that the chance of getting dents and scratches would be reduced.

Oren, if you are a visitor and poster on these boards, I'd like to invite you to pm or e-mail me since I want to ask you some more about your special tuba. Great job though from here on the other side of the pond who proudly plays the American adjustment to the tuba, the sousaphone. I think Sousa would have been proud.

Hank74

[Hank74]

How long has he played this instrument?

[Paul S]

Strange? perhaps compared to "run-of-the mill" but it is attractive, practical and perhaps even more true to tuba design than what most of us have in our laps.

Isn't this horn actually somewhat along the design of an Ophicleide or appear like an instrument that would be called a "Saxhorn"? It sure reminds me a lot of a brass Saxaphone...

hmmm Sax.. Adolphe Sax seems to ring a bell as an important name in tuba design history...

I really like the design as an orchestral horn and am sure it could be constructed to be easliy broken down for travel just as a bassoon or large sax is.

[Lew]

I know of at least 4 of these that still exist, and I'm sure there are more. I'm still kicking myself for not buying the one I saw about a year and a half ago for $2500.

[Chuck(G)]

I know of at least 4 of these that still exist, and I'm sure there are more. I'm still kicking myself for not buying the one I saw about a year and a half ago for $2500.

I believe that Fred Young's monster is built from one of these. I was only tempted to get the one shown last year. Then I thought about getting it to and from gigs and figured it'd be worse to lug around than my bass...

[Rick Denney]

Why do you think a tuba was designed the way that it looks now?

Because its visual model was a bassoon.

No, don't laugh.

Look at the Moritz tuba. It is held in front of the player, with both hands operating valves, quite similar to a bassoon.

It just got fatter over the years so that it would sound better.

The helicon was a carryable variation. The sousaphone was a bell-up helicon for omnidirectional sound (as Sousa wanted). The modern sousaphone is really a recording sousaphone. The progress from helicon to modern sousaphone took easily explainable steps.

Likewise the progress from the Russian Bassoon to the modern tuba. The Russian Bassoon was similar to the English Bass Horn (which was a bassoon-shaped variant of the serpent). The ophicleide was a variant on the Russian Bassoon. The keys and tone holes became valves, making the instrument truly chromatic for the first time. Even though the first tuba had five valves, they were not really necessary for many early applications, and many of the succeeding instruments had only three valves, like trumpets. It was easier for them to be manipulated by just one hand. (You'll find, however, a similar hand position between the original Moritz 3+2 5-valve F tuba of 1836 and a modern 4+2 rotary F tuba made today.) This led to more instruments operated by just one hand, and that caught on. We ended up after a few decads with four valves on the right hand, and no need for left-hand valves on contrabass instruments.

Then, as I said, they got fatter and fatter, because this made a more and more characteristic sound.

The designs we use today have been refined and tested over a century at least, so they are the shapes that serve the most players the best. But of course some players will have special needs and will be forced to innovate. That's what we see in this picture. The limitations on portability (I don't get on the Tubes with my tuba, but I darn sure have to fit it in the back of my Subaru!) would be one issue. The low bell would be another. It really follows more of a bass clarinet concept than a bassoon concept, and I'm not sure I'd want the sound coming out the bell to be that much in my face.

Is it really better from an ergonomic point of view? I'm not so sure, barring some specific need. When I use a stand, my tuba requires little effort to balance, despite its large size and weight. And the tuba will move with me, instead of me having to move to the tuba. But I'd rather have an instrument like this than not play the tuba at all.

Rick "who sees a natural evolution, not a design" Denney

[Kevin Hendrick]

... I do see one problem though, and that is how do you adjust to people of different heights?

How about adjustable-height seating for the player? An adjustable piano bench would probably work ... so might a drummer's throne (both available, I believe, at reasonable cost and in portable forms).

[scottmendoker]

I believe that the single floor peg is adjustable. Personally, I would LOVE to have an instrument like Oren's. New and different is good - especially if it works. And, I believe that this one REALLY works - especially in the hands of Oren Marshall.
The tuba doesn't sound like any other instrument - not trombone, certainly. I bet that the Orenaphone (as its' creator, Mike Johnson calls it) blends - probably "balances" is a better choice - extremely well with the trombones in a classical orchestral setting. Obviously, movie composers like it, as proven in the original picture. I'm sure that it's paid for itself - he's been using it for over 6 years - many times over.
Mike Johnson has to be congratulated for his creativity and craftsmanship!!

Scott Mendoker

[Tabor]

What I really like about that tuba is how the bell is neither to the right or left of the player. He has a clear field of vision.

-T

[Chuck(G)]

What I really like about that tuba is how the bell is neither to the right or left of the player. He has a clear field of vision.

...and his fellow musicians have someplace to put their cigar butts...

(just kidding!)