Now a Schleppy-sized BBBb - Bumblebee video

[Steve Marcus]

This is a photo of a lecture about the Reisentuba. Does anyone have the video of this presentation?

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... =1&theater

It would be nice to have the German in the videos translated to English, but one would expect that this "event" in Germany would be covered by German media.

[imperialbari]

Americans not schooled in German almost invariably makes searches impossible for themselves by switching ie into ei and vice versa. That likely is because the phonetics are reversed between German and American English. Riesen is giant and Reisen is travels. As there are giant tubas as well as travel tubas, German readers get confused. The best advice for Americans is about reacting against their intuition, when handling German constellations of i and e.

A search on Riesentuba gave two YouTube-hits. The concert fragment already presented. And a longer video from Voigt, who contributed the bell in this joint effort of the Markneukirchen makers, thereby reviving the old working modus, where parts are subcontracted to fellow master workshops and the engraving tells who did the design decisions and the assembly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoRxsyRF6co

Klaus

[Steve Marcus]

Klaus,

That was a very courteous way of pointing out my misspelling. Thank you.

Ian, here, finally, is the source of your dream 36" bell!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoRxsyRF6co" target="_blank

[imperialbari]

No, not directed towards any specific person, Steve.

It really is where many Americans run into dead end searches around German topics.

Klaus

[imperialbari]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 491&type=1

[imperialbari]

Bumblebee video 1.49 - not very loud recording:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8DV3cPhKkU

[Steve Marcus]

The best video thus far:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHIwfWavIm4

Although the Riesentuba is billed as a BBBb instrument, every pitch and corresponding fingering that we've seen Prof. Wachsmuth play thus far is in exactly the same octave as a standard BBb tuba, just louder. Open partials are BBb below the 2nd ledger line (an octave ABOVE the lowest Bb on the piano) and F at the bottom of the staff.

In contrast, the Hoffnung subcontrabass tuba built by Sanders and stored temporarily at Paxman is a true CCC horn. The open partials are CCC (lowest C on the piano), G (below the 3rd ledger line; lowest G on the piano), and CC above that (2nd ledger line). I have played the Hoffnung CCC and can personally testify that this is accurate. Theoretically, the fundamental of the Hoffnung CCC is the C BELOW the lowest C on a standard 88-note piano, but I was not able to make the horn play that note with its 16(?) hz frequency. However, it was easy to play the GGG (fingering 1-3) and GGGb (fingering 1-2-3) on this 3-rotor horn. Yes, the same notes can be played as pedal notes down from the fundamental on a standard CC tuba. But these same notes on the CCC subcontrabass tuba have a resonance unlike any "ordinary" CC tuba. Technically, they are NOT pedal notes on the CCC subcontrabass tuba because they are not BELOW the fundamental.

In a newspaper article at http://www.focus.de" target="_blank, Herr Harmut Geilert, the horn's principal builder (with the help of other individuals and companies in Germany), states, "Die größte Tuba der Welt ist es nicht (This is not the largest tuba in the world) -- wohl aber die größte spielbare Tuba der Welt" (but it is the largest playable tuba in the world). The first phrase is accurate. For example, there is a non-playable tuba at the Harriman Museum that formerly graced the Boosey factory roof. But the largest playable tuba in the world? That is arguable. The Geilert tuba is certainly taller than the Hoffnung tuba. But the bugle on the Hoffnung is considerably wider than the new Geilert Riesentuba, and the bell appears to be wider, as well.

Perhaps, with some humor, one might say that the Geilert Riesentuba is the largest playable "Kaiser-type" tuba in the world (unless the Amati FFF is playable and can defend its size), while the Hoffnung CCC is a "York-style" subcontrabass tuba.

[imperialbari]

Yes, a much better video. Professionally made by the Vogtland area regional TV-station.

Not so much playing on the giant, rather a report on its idea and development, which was halted when the employer of Hartmut Geilert (Roland Meinl - Neustadt -Aisch - Bavaria, but not too far from Markneukirchen) stopped making tubas, until the Markneukirchen band leader motivated sponsors to make it for the Markneukirchen town jubilee, which here is said to have been in 2010.The tuba could not be finished as planned. The knuckles out of the rotor casings were the main problem, until made by a retired valve maker. Therefor the body (Korpus) was presented on a truck in the parade for the town jubilee, where it met much interest by the public.

The South German dialect of the project initiator, the life long tuba maker Hartmut Geilert, sadly is not as understandable as the more High German tone of the female journalist, so some details are hard or impossible to get.

Klaus

[imperialbari]

I trust Steve’s ear for pitches and octaves. Still I am very sure he gets the pitch of this true BBBb wrong by calling an oversize BBb.

Jörg Wachsmuth says the normal length of tubing for BBb is 10 meters, which is just about right, if the 4-valve tubing is included. And then he says this BBBb has a length of 20 meters.

The reason Jörg Wachsmuth plays in the same octave as a BBb would is, that he takes everything up an octave compared to the one octave lower partials of the BBBb.

I see two possible reasons for Jörg Wachsmuth using normal BBb fingerings in the relatively high range of the BBBb, which he uses, as he would run out of air and would have response problems, if he took the sound down an octave:

Some partials (5th) may be off, so that C sound more in tune with 4 than with 1. (If tuning shall be exact I use the fingerings from between the 2nd and 3rd partials also between the 4th and 6th partials on all of my tubas, so the approach of Jörg Wachsmuth is not foreign to me).

And the very profane reason may be that Jörg Wachsmuth has these fingerings deeply engrained from a life long of tuba playing, so that he keeps his usual relationship between sound and pitch despite the potentially different fingerings on the one octave lower instrument.

Klaus

[Steve Marcus]

Klaus may have a valid point.

It would be informative and fun if Prof. Wachsburg or someone else could post a video of them playing a chromatic scale from BBb (below the 2nd ledger line) down to BBBb (lowest Bb on the piano)...and even lower for good measure. The FF (4th ledger line) should be played with no valves if this is a true BBBb subcontrabass tuba.

[MikeW]

...For example, there is a non-playable tuba at the Harriman Museum that formerly graced the Boosey factory roof...

Actually, it's at the Horniman museum, it has been restored, and they describe it as fully playable.
EDIT: I just double-checked on the Horniman website, which says the valves don't move, so you can only play the harmonic series.
EDIT: and here's the link that says the beast is playable - I was beginning to think I'd been hallucinating again http://londonist.com/2009/03/from_the_h ... b_tuba.php

From an old thread, there are two more Besson BBBbs from the same batch, apparently made for the Sousa band. One is now in the Harvard bandroom, and the other is in the New York offices of Carl Fischer Music; both of these were playable-ish when last mentioned.

Also in contention are the CCC made by Sanders for Gerard Hoffnung, and modified by Paxman, and the Amati FFF (someone mentioned the Amati FFF as being listed in the Guinness Book of Records)

[imperialbari]

http://www.das-musikinstrument.de/news- ... 668146ec2f

[Steve Marcus]

Klaus, thanks for this reference. It seems to contain almost exactly the same copy as a previously released article.

As others have stated, it would be very interesting to see and hear a video of Prof. Wachburg's entire performance on the Riesentuba, not just excerpts.

[imperialbari]

I get the links in from B&S and saw this was from the site of the zine for the German music industry & trade. So I relayed the link. Once had access to the paper version of that zine. Very interesting to see how some companies specialize. One of them made pedals and their connecting rods for grand pianos, and apparently nothing else.

Btw. I wonder why this link does not come through as an active hyperlink.

As for the missing videos of the full performance I see two possible reasons. Copyright & the possibility that the soloist didn’t like his own performance.

Klaus

[bisontuba]

Hi-
In the video interview with the builder, did anyone notice the 6 valve 'travel tuba?' Very interesting.....
Mark

[imperialbari]

Not as I got it.

The scaled down F was an inspiration for the BBBb. The maker of the small one was one of the contributors to the BBBb. i may have to look at the video again. However the Southern German dialect is not easy to understand, and names cannot be deduced from the context.

Klaus from my iPad

[Rick F]

Bumblebee video 1.49 - not very loud recording:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8DV3cPhKkU

Here's a better link:
Flight of the Tuba Bee

[imperialbari]

Yes, a much better link!

Still, Schleppy would be much better armed to play that tuba.

[Steve Marcus]

Here's another presentation of Prof. Jörg Wachsmuth playing the Reisentuba, posted on New Year's Day 2013, with TV introduction in German:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... JDUp2PlT2s

I'd still like to hear more of the unique low sounds of the Riesentuba.

[bort]

I don't speak German very well, but did I hear them say that it costs 130,000 Euro?

If so, that's a LOT of money. Now, I'm sure that it's an expensive tuba to make. But more than anything, it sounds like the manufacturer saying "we don't want to make another one!"