Hello to everyone. My first post. I need advice.

[BavarianFanfare]

In reference to your question concerning a Miraphone 186 or 191, owning a Miraphone 187 myself, I can say that you cannot go wrong with a Miraphone. I regularly play on a 1970's model Miraphone 186 with the shorter bell at the university, and play on a VMI 2103 and Miraphone 187 away from the university. I really like and enjoy Miraphone's instruments. As far as the 191, I have not tried one. I am thirty-seven years old and went back to school in 2004. I earned my Associate in Arts degree from Houston Community College in May of 2008, and then transferred to Prairie View A&M University in Prairie View, Texas in August 2008. I hope to be working in the field by sometime in 2011. It is a great deal of work. I encourage you to go back and earn your degree in Music Education if it is what you really desire to do. Since you stated that you have a great deal of time, I would say that is a real plus. In my case, I work, have a family, and am a full-time student. It is a real challenge sometimes to balance everything. Again, I encourage you to pursue this if you really want to do it. Best wishes to you and follow your passion!

[The Big Ben]

A Miraphone of any type will be a reliable, consistent horn.

You've had many experiences in your life. If you want to become a music teacher, go for it. Try to talk to as many school band directors as you can to find out what it is really like today. In some ways, the modern band director is almost more a public relations man than a teacher of music. So much fundraising! But, if you want it, you should be able to get it.

[Dan Schultz]

From my personal point of view... knowing what I've learned from the music community over the last ten or so years.... I'm very glad that I embarked on an engineering career back in 1967 when I returned from the Navy. Although I really enjoyed music in those early years, I can see now that engineering was the correct choice because it furnished me with a chance to make a good living without a whale of a lot of competition. Today, I am enjoying music to its fullest. I think had I chosen a career in music teaching at the very beginning, I would have been burned out years ago. Someone alluded to teaching music in high school as more administrative and fund-raising than actually teaching. I know several music teachers who won't pick up a horn at the end of their day in classroom.

Welcome to TubeNet and good luck with whatever you decide to do. This is a good community.

[tofu]

[TubaCoopa]

I would recommend searching here on TubeNet for each of the tubas you're considering. I guaruntee you'll find scores of information. Plus, it's a lot less intimidating than starting a new thread. Have fun lurking!

[MileMarkerZero]

Welcome back!

As a person that laid off of the horn for a period of several years right after college, I can attest that coming back to the horn was one of the best things I ever did. But there were a couple of issues that I hadn't anticipated...

Since you're going to have access to a loaner, I can't emphasize strongly enough that you get a few sessions with an advanced player right off the bat. There are a fair number of them around ChiTown. By making sure that you aren't getting into some bad habits right from the get-go, you can save yourself months to years in getting back into good playing condition. It really surprised me how many things I was doing poorly when I returned to the horn that were not even on the radar screen when I was playing regularly...making the best use of air (I still have to really think about that after being back playing over 10 years), embouchure issues (I never had to think about that in college, but upon return, it wasn't nearly as instinctive as it had been), etc. Just basic playing mechanics.

I don't know that my experience is typical, but I'm pretty sure that it isn't uncommon.

I hope you have as much fun the second time around as I am.

[iiipopes]

Congrats. The Jupiters have come up in quality in recent years, and are good horns.

When you do finally decide to purchase your own tuba, all I have to add is that a friend of mine in community band has a birth defect that affects the left side of his body in a similar way to a stroke. He has a 186 and does well on it. Plus, with the ability to align the paddles and thumb ring to whatever a player needs ergonomically (well, like any rotary tuba), and being relatively lighter, well-balanced in weight placement and proportion, the 186 is a very player-friendly tuba. It is also such a well-known tuba that anywhere you go to play you will find immediate universal acceptance, regardless.

It may not do everything in a superlative manner, but it can do everything at least rather well, with the possible exception of large orchestra work, and is a great horn for any community band.

[scottw]

I think in about six months time I will be able to recover my chops.
Cheers.
George H. Boyd

Putting a time table to it has positive and negative effects. You are setting a deadline for yourself--do it now rather than procrastinate, and that's positive. But, as soon as you possibly can, seek out some church or community band and start ensemble playing, regardless if you are 100% convinced you are "ready".As long as you are emitting some relatively-pleasing sounds, know your fingerings, and demonstrate the ability to count properly, push yourself to go for it and join an ensemble. Otherwise, you will not get the benefits of ensemble playing as long as you wait for the day when you have "recover[ed your] chops. Look at it this way: if you can do all the above, you are at least on a par with the last chair tuba player in most bands! lol

[sloan]

Remember that I have not played in 23 years, so please be humane.

Hey, I resemble that remark. I took 25 years off (returned to the fold 11 years ago). I've been where you are.

My advice is: <I learned all of these rules by violating them...and then reforming...somewhat>

a) method books are good - I like Rubanks, ALL of them. I like Rubanks better than Arbans because Rubanks gives you a lesson PLAN. This is especially useful when you are at the "Intermediate" level.

b) recording (and then listening) is priceless <I still don't do nearly enough of this>

c) "start from success and expand from there" Gene Pokorny, TUSABTEC 2004. Start in the middle and go up and down from there. At the end of a session, you should try (once or twice, no more) a note one half step higher (and lower) than you think you can play - but you should play many notes near there and many, many, many notes in your comfort zone. Think of a bell curve - hundreds of "bottom of the staff" F's for every middle-C. Every so often, one of those "unreachable" notes will just be there. Congratulations on meeting your quota, Comrade; as a reward, we have raised your quota. Extreme notes come from solid chops; solid chops come from playing lots and lots of notes (not necessarily the extreme ones).

d) FIND AN ENSEMBLE - best is a community band with at least one existing tuba. One hour of rehearsal with the ensemble is worth 2 hours in your practice room. Sometimes it MOTIVATES you to spend a few more hours in the practice room. Find a band that takes "all-comers" (and remember to stay with that band when you get to the point where it starts to feel "below" you). Learn to play tastefully with others, when discretion is the better part of valor, and when to take the lead when it's your turn. When a passage is too dificult, STFU and listen to your section mates, and (heaven forbid) the rest of the band. See those "rests"? Don't play there.

e) find a teacher. You don't need regular lessons (better to add another ensemble!) - but every once in a while it helps to be evaluated and re-directed by someone who knows how to do that. Come away from every lesson with a specific plan of attack on your current weakness.

f) play tunes NOT in the method books "by ear". Play around with them. Play them for pure tone, and play them for pure "cheese". Noodle. Improvise on them. Use these in your warm-up and warm-down. Play them in as many different keys as you can. Pop tunes, church standards, anything that you have in your head withOUT music. That is, anything you can HUM.

g) sing. LOUDLY. with FEELING. sing it - hum it - buzz it - play it. Rinse and Repeat.

h) avoid at all costs the tendency to evaluate your play by what your RANGE is. Range is the *least* important part of your playing. 75% of your notes in a mid-level band will all be (or can be safely transposed) in one octave (Bb to Bb). 95% will be in two octaves (F to F). Listening to your audio files, you are already reasonably comfortable in that 2 octave range. Concentrate on making those notes more secure and don't worry about the others. That said - you should try (a little) to extend your range IN THE PRACTICE ROOM. Don't try it in the ensemble - no one wants to hear squeaks and farts. Silence is better than a note that SOUNDS LIKE it was difficult to play. You get ZERO points for "effort" in the ensemble. Take your "practice room range" and subtract about a 3rd off both the top and the bottom. Yes - you can play those notes, but no one wants to hear them.

i) whatever you do, don't waste time playing all 19 scales in all 12 keys around the ring of 4ths. It's too late for that. And besides, only "bloke" cares about that stuff.

Oh yeah...your audio files. My first thought is that you need to fix those stutter-step attacks. I'm sure someone else can give advice on HOW to do that (and...can they please tell me, too?)

[sailn2ba]

I REALLY am trying to get info on the 191. It gets great reviews by itself, but when folks discuss other models, it just gets ignored. Is the 191 BBb a compact 5/4 or not?

[iiipopes]

Blessing 18 -- the best mouthpiece Bach never made.

[Roger Lewis]

Hi George.

It was a great pleasure to get to work with you and your lovely wife. You're going to do just fine as you re-invent yourself. Fundamentals, fundamental, fundamentals.

Practice smart and have a lot of fun.

All the best to you.

Roger

[jonesbrass]

I may be wrong on this, but it's my understanding that the bore of the tuba is what determines the horn size.

I wish it was as simple as that, but the bore size is not the only (or even primary) factor. Most of the 6/4 "american" type CC and BBb tubas have smaller bore sizes (~.750) than the 4/4 "German" style horns (~.770-.795). Primarily, it is the manufacturer who determines X/4.

[scottw]

I just received a copy of "J.B. Arban Complete Method for Tuba" today.

335 pages. If I had an ego before, it's hiding under the bed now.
I know if I stick with it, and do what Roger tells me to do I'll get it right.
I feel like I'm learning all over again and it is tough feeling to deal with.

But that's the fun of learning music.
The more you learn, the better you get, and you can never learn it all.

If any of you who have picked it up again after a long time away have anything to add, I'd like to hear it.

Cheers.
George H. Boyd

I was basically off tuba for 25 years, playing only occasionally with my students for a lesson.While I played bass and made some money, I never really cared for it as much as I did tuba, but, with a young family, I knew what i had to do with my time. After I retired from teaching, I found that tuba was something I needed to reconnect with; that proved to be a wise thing, as I had a left-hand accident with a tablesaw a few years after re-starting my tuba playing! It's been 7 1/2 years and I can't say I play much better than I did in college, but I see improvement of some facet of my playing every single day, and I know my musicianship is vastly better than it was back then, too. Keep at it and you too will see more and more coming back to you. BTW, isn't there some way you can arrange to borrow the tuba over the summer? That's something that teachers arrange all the time to keep kids [and teachers, too!] in the music, avoiding a September fiasco.
Congratulations on playing your first concert!

[sloan]

I took 25 years off, and came back 11 years ago. This weekend, I played my first Orchestra gig.

Strangely enough, it was a college Orchestra ALUMNI Concert - and I never played in the college orchestra.
But, my wife did, and I somehow got on the mailing list. I *was* in the band, and I was back for my 40th Reunion, so...why not?

We both played - in very nearly the same spot that we first played together (in the Band) for an opening convocation event, in 1969.

My only question is: how do you make a tuba sound like an ophicleide? (we played the Overture to Zampa, and that's what my part said).

Cross-referencing the "case" thread - I flew my King 2341 in an MTS case, and had zero difficulty. Delta agents were sometimes a little uncertain, but eventually agreed that it was neither oversized nor overweight for a musical instrument. They charged $15 each way - but that is their current charge for any checked bag.

The fun part was when my rental car was towed with the tuba in it. The police would only release the car to the owner (that would be Hertz) and neither the police nor Hertz had anyone on duty on Memorial Day weekend to deal with it. It took me about 3 hours, first waiting for Hertz to make arrangements, and then dealing with going to the tow lot where I was allowed to retrieve the contents of the car. Hertz retrieved the car today. It's a tribute to how much I enjoyed the rest of this weekend that this ordeal didn't really phase me. We had already completed most of the weekend's activities, and we made it to the airport (with the tuba) in plenty of time for the trip home.

Now for a musical question. Remember that this was an alumni reunion concert. We had about 4 hours of rehearsal for about a half hour of music (Zampa Overture, Brunoniana: Songs of Brown (a 1947 arrangement by Leroy Anderson - from the arrangement, it's clear he was a Harvard guy), "Hoe-Down" from Rodeo, Radetzky March, Pirates of the Caribbean, and "Berceuse" and "Finale" from Firebird Suite). We had near perfect instrumentation (no 4th horn, an extra trombone and an extra trumpet - we were also missing a harp; what a pity). Rehearsal was decidedly low-key - essentially, we played the entire program straight through about 5 times with very little tweaking.

The conductor sent me the Bass Trombone part for Radetzky, and said "you're coming all that way...and there's no tuba part" (well, duh!) So, I put it into Sibelius in octaves and thought that I would wait to see what (if any) of it would be appropriate to play. I ended up covering the Bass Trombone part during one rehearsal because the Bass Trombonist had a conflicting commitment - but finally decided that I wasn't needed, so I sat out the performance. Any opinions on whether this was the right decision?

I also played the "Berceuse" perfectly. It sounded lovely.

[Tuba Guy]

Drop a black Florsheim dress shoe down the bell. These seem to have the proper dampening effect on the overtone series to allow a decent imitation of an ophicleide. Do not use Thom McAn shoes for this effect at all. They generally impart a bit too much of a serpent tone to the tuba and are, therefore, not recommended for this application. Sneakers just sound like a shoe in the bell.

You say that as a joke and if not a joke, then I'd be a little worried about you, but a paddle in the bell (and settling down in the bottom bow) really DOES make the sound clearer. I have no idea how or why.

[tubamonster]

Deaf people should still be able to feel you shake the building. This would work especially well with a Miraphone 191 (my personal choice) or 1291, or a Fafner.

tubamonster

[J.c. Sherman]

My only question is: how do you make a tuba sound like an ophicleide? (we played the Overture to Zampa, and that's what my part said).

The same way you make a soprano saxophone sound like a viola d'amore...

J.c.S.

[imperialbari]

makes me wonder as the right tuba is said to be a King.

Did King make top valved tubas that big?

I rather would suspect it being a Conn 21J.

Klaus