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Hi all,

I've read through some posts about these 2 horns and was wondering if there is any significant difference between them.

I currently have a naked lady 20k that plays great. A naked lady 38k has become available and I'm thinking about trading my 20k for it. Is it worth the hassle or do these horns basically perform the same?

I have played both:
1) The 38K has a 24-inch bell; the 20K has a 26-inch bell.
2) The 38K has conventional valves; the 20K has the short-action valves, including the offset valve stems.
3) Because of the valve block differences and squeezed valve ports, the 20K has the flat 5th partials, especially 2nd space C 1st valve; the 38K has better overall intonation characteristics.
4) the 38K weighs 35 pounds, and has the flat flange soldered to the bugle to help spread the load on the shoulder, the 20K does not.
5) For me, the 38k sounded best with a PT82 mouthpiece; the 20K sounds equally bad whatever mouthpiece you use.
5) There are other minor differences with the receiver and other small details, but these are the two main differences.
6) For further reference, the Conn Loyalist page: https://cderksen.home.xs4all.nl/ConnBass.html .

I haven't played any sousaphones that are overall "better" than the 20K. Maybe some were as good, in certain aspects. Also, it depends on application. Some sousaphones can offer easier playability in certain types of ensembles/music. For example, the Conn 14K, or old Kings, might be easier for some players to get more "punch." Ultimately, it really depends on the player, what works best for you. So after all that said, try the 38K to see if it's better for you. Best of luck

iiipopes wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:02 pm ...
4) the 38K weighs 35 pounds, and has the flat flange soldered to the bugle to help spread the load on the shoulder, the 20K does not.
...

For the record, my 1950's Conn 20K weighs 28 lb and DOES have the shoulder flange thing.

greenbean wrote: ↑Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:48 pm

iiipopes wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:02 pm ...
4) the 38K weighs 35 pounds, and has the flat flange soldered to the bugle to help spread the load on the shoulder, the 20K does not.
...

For the record, my 1950's Conn 20K weighs 28 lb and DOES have the shoulder flange thing.

Lucky you. The ones I played did not.

iiipopes wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:02 pm the 20K sounds equally bad whatever mouthpiece you use.

The 20K is the most popular sousaphone among pros. I used mine for a recording session with Columbia Records last winter and use it as my main gigging axe after years of using a 1291. I think you may have tried a lemon or something in awful condition. The fact that it was missing the shoulder plate tells me it was probably just in disrepair

tubaphillips wrote: ↑Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:16 pm

iiipopes wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:02 pm the 20K sounds equally bad whatever mouthpiece you use.

The 20K is the most popular sousaphone among pros. I used mine for a recording session with Columbia Records last winter and use it as my main gigging axe after years of using a 1291. I think you may have tried a lemon or something in awful condition. The fact that it was missing the shoulder plate tells me it was probably just in disrepair

Well, yes, it was a college instrument. Perhaps a lot of it is the 2nd space C being very low and having to remember to use 1+3. I am not adverse to trying another 20K if the opportunity presents itself. I am probably also spoiled that for the short while I got to use a 38K, it was truly magnificient: well in tune, easy to play, a foundational tone that could shake floors at moderate volume, and seamless transition from low range to privilege tones to true pedal tones; no 4th valve needed.

The 38k that I had and sold to Matt Perrin, was not a 24" bell. It was 26 inch and I don’t know where the information that the 20k has a 26 inch bell and the 38k has a 24 inch bell got obtained.

It’s a great horn. It’s heavy like hell and it’s why I sold it.
I now play a old Conn 14k stencil (Geo. Bundy) that plays very well and is much lighter.

You gotta be young and strong to play a 35-pound sousaphone!... My 20K is 28 pounds and I can't handle it. My King fiberglass sousa is 18-19 pounds - I forget which - and it is enjoyable to play! Also one of the easiest-to-play tubas I have played.

There is nothing wrong with fiberglass sousaphones... as long as they aren't white...

Sylvano wrote: ↑Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:17 am The 38k that I had and sold to Matt Perrin, was not a 24" bell. It was 26 inch and I don’t know where the information that the 20k has a 26 inch bell and the 38k has a 24 inch bell got obtained.

Three sources: 1) personal measurement of the 38K I got to play; and 2) other threads through the years on both forums that have talked about the bell size on a 38K, including this thread: viewtopic.php?t=43255 . and 3) the page out of the 1924 Conn catalog, attached. It appears you may have had a horn that a 20K bell was retrofitted.

greenbean wrote: ↑Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:18 am You gotta be young and strong to play a 35-pound sousaphone!... My 20K is 28 pounds and I can't handle it. My King fiberglass sousa is 18-19 pounds - I forget which - and it is enjoyable to play! Also one of the easiest-to-play tubas I have played.

There is nothing wrong with fiberglass sousaphones... as long as they aren't white...

I played a Conn 38K, nickle plated, in College. Marching band, military style.

I got it because I was (a) a freshman, and (b) stout,

It had to weigh 45 lbs,

Legend was that it was a trade in from the Barnum and Bailey Circus.

if had an incredible sound, just really full and robust without much effort, but damn, was it heavy.