Eb recommendations

[Lectron]

My MW 2141 is no longer holding the standard.
Valves are leaky and it really need a full refurb with replating and/or new valve cluster

I've quite liked the instrument, after a few ergonomic modifications, but I want to look elsewhere for a new (used)
It needs to be front action and funds are limited.....If not I'd probably go Mira NS

The more affordable ones that has caught my eye is the Wessex Danube, Wessex Gnagey and Eastman 853
Albeit Bloke would say "3+1 is the only way to go on an Eb", it has to be FA, compensated or non compensated, no really strong opinion
It does not have to be a "do it all" horn.
I would like the Danube to be nice, as I favour rotary and shorter action, but really haven't seen ANY good critics
But there again....Can anything have longer action than the MW? I assume the Gnagey and Eastman are both better there.

So..Any recommendations or 1st hand experience with the mentioned models?

They are probably all better than my 2141

[daktx2]

I've played both the Gnagey and the 2141 in elephant room situations, but can't speak to the Eastman or Danube. Opinions follow!

The Gnagey was pretty good, intonation was good on first pass and I had an easy time getting a nice tone out of it. However, the low register wasn't quite as intuitive as I'd prefer out of a bigger Eb.

I preferred the 2141, which was great. It played a bit bigger, and had a C tuba like low register. Intonation was also pretty good, and the sound was wonderful. (The even more expensive Wilson and Miraphone NS were also marvelous, though the NS was a very different blow).

A friend recently had his valves refurbished on an older 3+1 B and H. All of these prices are US, so EU costs might be a bit different (there's only one person doing this in the US). His tech took the valve section off, and mailed it to Dan Oberloh. It took quite a long time, but the results were marvelous, the horn is as good as new. Total cost was under 2000. If I were doing this in the US and could afford the wait, I'd go the rebuild route, as it'd end up costing the same with better results. A new Gnagey is ~4000, and I can't imagine I'd get much more than 2000 stateside for a leaky 2141.

Good luck in the Eb journey!

[Snake Charmer]

The Eastman 853 is quite comfortable to play and offers a lot of punch in the low register. I added a lever for playing the 4th valve with the left hand, after playing 3+x configurations for decades I was not able to get used to 4R.
The Wessex Gnagey has a very awkward mounted valveset which forces the right wrist into a very uncomfortable angle (even worse than the Yamaha 621 F tuba!).
Never played the Danube, but what about the St. Petersburg 206? Sound and quality are on the same level as the Eastman but with 5 rotary valves instead of 4 compensating pistons.

[Lectron]

The Eastman 853 is quite comfortable to play and offers a lot of punch in the low register. I added a lever for playing the 4th valve with the left hand, after playing 3+x configurations for decades I was not able to get used to 4R.
The Wessex Gnagey has a very awkward mounted valveset which forces the right wrist into a very uncomfortable angle (even worse than the Yamaha 621 F tuba!).
Never played the Danube, but what about the St. Petersburg 206? Sound and quality are on the same level as the Eastman but with 5 rotary valves instead of 4 compensating pistons.

OK, so the Gnagey is out of the equation then. Can’t have “ergonomically awkward “ . Too old for that.
And the StPete. Nice for what it does nice, but don’t fancy that BBb. Enough Ebs without that issue (dreaded C F-tuba phenomena)

The 2141 could be played 3+1 (or 2+2). Nice sometimes, especially with those long stroke valves

I would assume the Eastman is not far from a Besson 983,
As for low register…I do not expect ANY other Eb to match the 2141

Maybe I just need to save up a bit…..or go small CC

[Snake Charmer]

The Eastman is more comfortable than the Besson, in playing a bit more V8 compared to inline-6 Besson, but the Besson may offer a bit more built quality. I had some minor issues with the Eastman.
For the St. Pete: I was speaking of the the 206 Eb! Just a solid affordable allround Eb. I don't want a BBb for me as well...

[Yane]

Have an Eastman 853 and like it, for comparison I dreamed of a 983, but even used ones were too beyond the budget; ended up with a deal on a lightly used horn. From my limited blowing on the 983, I agree the 853 is probably a better all-purpose horn than the solo oriented 983. The 853 is good for the money, though I wish the 3rd valve was a little shorter; may get it cut someday, there is an absurd amount of adjustment possible on the 3rd valve so it should not be a problem.

[Lectron]

Have an Eastman 853 and like it, for comparison I dreamed of a 983, but even used ones were too beyond the budget; ended up with a deal on a lightly used horn. From my limited blowing on the 983, I agree the 853 is probably a better all-purpose horn than the solo oriented 983. The 853 is good for the money, though I wish the 3rd valve was a little shorter; may get it cut someday, there is an absurd amount of adjustment possible on the 3rd valve so it should not be a problem.

Thanks.
My main concern with a compensator is the low register.
How is the 853 below BBb…is it very noticeable that one all of a sudden doubles the valveports and bends?
Most bessons are not to my liking there compared to a 5V solution

[Snake Charmer]

The Eastman is stronger and more open in the low range than the Besson, at least compared to the top action models. I played a 981 for 25 years but switched to the front action Eastman due to shoulder problems (coudn't reach the 4th valve any longer!)
The difference in resistance is there when the 4th valve comes in, but the range from Bb under the staff down to pedal Eb needs not too much breath effort to get a big sound. Some players of 3/4 Bb tubas envied me sometimes for a solid low F

[Yane]

I second the evaluation that the 853 is not as stuffy down low as a Besson or Boosey; while there is some extra resistance the increase is fairly linear, not a dramatic leap when the 4th valve is involved. I don’t have experience on 5 or 6 valve horns beyond test playing at tuba conferences so I can’t offer a confident comparison.

[Lectron]

Thank you all

[marccromme]

A thought on Wessex Danube versus MW 2141, I have owned both and sold the Danube again. I do prefer the MW 2141 because

Better and warmer low register, pretty well intune, easy access to 4th valve slide, which I use as a trigger to get a few of the longest valve combinations in tune, most notably F one tone over pedal EB, the pedals are nice, stable, and sound good.

In general the MW 2141 has a warmer an broader sound, and is more free blowing than the Danube, where the Danube is slimmer in sound, has more resistance.

For my kind of playing, which is concert band and brass band, I prefer the MW.

Your preferences might be different, depending on your playing needs