trill in gregson on BBb

daktx2 · Post by **daktx2** » Tue May 11, 2004 6:19 pm

im beginning my first real journey on really difficult solos and concertos with the gregson. i have a question on the proper way to do to those trills from G to A in the staff on a BBb tuba. there is that annoying flat 7th partial(correct me if i'm wrong) that makes the 2nd valve be able to play the G(though very flat) that makes this difficult to pull off. there is the same problem with the 1,2 valve because of the 9th partial (ithink), and that can also play both notes. will I want to approach this as a lip trill?(which i can't do yet) if so, are there any good exercises to build up that type of crazy flexibility?
thanks

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Tue May 11, 2004 7:02 pm

i just finished the gregson and i love that piece. i played it on a CC tuba and had a hard time on the trills. i imagine that a BBb would be hard to. have you tried 3 to 2 on the trill? That valve combination is SLIGHTLY easier than 12 to 2. Good luck on that piece.

daktx2 · Post by **daktx2** » Tue May 11, 2004 7:08 pm

the fingers arent my problem. it is that both notes are playable in the same valve combinations, causing some problems because the fingers are fast enough but the lips must also adjust.
it is a kickass piece

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Tue May 11, 2004 7:48 pm

yeah, come to think about it, you must really have some awesome chops to play that piece on a BBb. that piece is the whole reason i'm going to buy an F tuba this fall. haha. i do understand the talk of partials tho. the 3 to 2 like i said is slightly easier, but not by much. that's just a really iffy region on any horn.

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Tue May 11, 2004 8:52 pm

come to think about it, i have a recording of myself playing the gregson tuba concerto on my web-site. haha. you can hear how terribly i played the trills. haha.
http://www.murphy.insanelytrendy.com/record.html

I'm not exactly Arnold Jacobs, but it'll give you an idea of what it sounds like.

daktx2 · Post by **daktx2** » Tue May 11, 2004 10:40 pm

all of my talk about partials is trying to say that both notes can be played in both valve combinations, just out of tune. i guess i'm just overanalyzing it. maybe i won't hold the trill out. or practice all summer until i can lip trill it cleanly.

timayer · Post by **timayer** » Wed May 12, 2004 12:33 pm

This is just like the trill in Meistersinger for the CC tuba. I worked it out so that I could lip-trill the A to the B with 2nd valve down, and once I could do that, I started putting the normal valves down. It just takes some work. Good luck

Tim Ayer

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Wed May 12, 2004 1:17 pm

Written for an Eb, huh? That's fascinating. I didn't buy an F, not yet, and not specifically for that piece. I've been kind of wondering about Eb tubas though. They're kind of mystical... not as well looked into. And yet, many folks say if they only own one horn, Eb would be it. I am going to have to get in the loop here somehow!!

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Thu May 13, 2004 12:01 am

hahaha... i'm waiting on that CD to come back and then i'll have us on there!

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Mon May 17, 2004 10:21 pm

(Warning to purists - bottom paragraph contains pro contrabass tuba material)
Just wanted to put my two cents in on this, since I performed the first movent of the Gregson on a CC at a joint recital recently. I had a lot of the same problems with the trill on CC that you have on BBb. It was only after spending a disproportionate amount of time on the trill every day that I finally became satisfied with it. I tried lip trilling and alternate fingering tricks, but finally settled on standard fingerings and just worked my butt off on it until it started to come around in a couple of weeks. It is especially important for the lower note of the trill to be in tune, that is the note it starts and ends on. Ther is a little more "fudge factor" on the upper note, but I worked at getting both of them to slot where they should by just playing it slowly and in tune and gradually speeding up until one day it was where it should be.
On a separate note, I commend you for playing it on a contrabass tuba. I feel that a big tuba gives this piece a certain noble character that a smaller horn, particularly a germanic F, does not. Playing it on a 2145 CC with a reasonably large mouthpiece (Parke-Ofenloch), I was able to get a very full rich sound out of the lyrical sections while making the fast parts powerfully bouncy, and the lines going to the bottom register dark, clear, and in tune vs. edgy pedals. Yes, the high register sixteenths on the top of the third page took a LOT of work, but in the end came out crystal clear. I have received comments from professors on how parts of the piece sounded "heroic", "John Williams-ish" or "almost like the theme from Superman." There was a certain power to it that would have been lacking on a bass tuba. Whether this was the composer's original intention or not, I do not know, but it did seem to work. I will be performing the entire piece at my senior recital later this year, and although I will have a 4/4 rotary F at my disposal I will still choose to do it again on the CC.