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I am a college student starting to browse for an F tuba. I play on a 6/4 pt-7 and I really wanna know what you guys think the best ORCHESTRAL F tuba would be.

Thanks

Andy Smith

Yamaha 822?

I play on a 6/4 Neptune (very similar to a PT-7) and I use a Miraphone 181 - 6 valve. But really it depends on the player more than the instrument. I've heard really good things about the big Yamaha 822 and the Miraphone 181 is a solid tuba.

Still looking with my prof.
The orchestra is large enough to pull off Mahler 2 (130 member)
I play on a 6/4 pt-7 that's all i own. I am playing on a school owned 6 valve gold brass pt 16.
The repertoire would be anything that calls for BASS tuba. Especially for Auditions.
I want an F because a 6/4 cc isn't really an option for playing things like Mahler 1, Bydlo, Romeo and Juliet, High solo Rep., small chamber ensemble work. etc...

I really just want to know people's opinions on best LARGE ORCHESTRAL F tuba out there.


Thanks again for your input!!!

Mate everybody has different opinions, you need to get out there and try a few horns and see what works for you!

You already play a b&s, maybe try something by them first. They work very well for some people, and others just can't stand them.

Try Miraphone, try Melton, try every horn that you possibly can, and pick the best one for you!

Just because so and so plays on this doesn't mean it will work for you!

I know that I have to try out horns, I just wanna know what OTHER PEOPLES OPINIONS are.


Thanks again
Andy

The Rudolf Meinl F's are hard to beat.

I would look at the new Mirafones (including the 181) and the big Yamaha (822).

My likes:
-Big bore
-Good intonation
-Good low register (it might be an F, but it's still a tuba!)

I'm not sure if there is such thing as an orchestral F. With C tubas, you tend to see a lot of the same horn in different orchestras. (PT-6, Nirschl, Gronitz) It seems with F tubas, there's a much greater variety. I've seen a lot of different brands and sizes. If you want something that puts out a lot of sound, you might try the Willson or Gronitz. A large B&S F might match your CC tuba a bit better though. How do you feel about the PT-16 you're using now?

I think with bass tubas there's a lot more room for personal choice since lots of times it's about playing solo lines (Mahler 1, Petrouchka, Bydlo, Sensemaya, etc) and not being the bottom of the orchestra.

What do I know though? I play Eb!!

You might want to wait until the Alan Baer designed "Kodiak" F tuba is in production.

Thanks once again for your input. I am looking for a bigger horn to fit in with the bigger horn i play now. I like the PT 16, however the lower register is very uneven and difficult. My professor has both the yamaha 822 and the PT 10 anniversary model. I was leaning towards trying the yamahammer more seriously than others, but I'm still not positive. I want the depth and roundness that i can get out of my pt7 but I want the lighter qualities and tone color changes of a smaller F. Once more thank you all for your input.

Andy

bigbear19 wrote:I want the depth and roundness that i can get out of my pt7 but I want the lighter qualities and tone color changes...

The tonal and weight gap between your massive PT-7 and any F is going to be absolutely huge. If it is specifically for large orchestra use, a 4/4 CC may be a better bet to fulfil your requirements as quoted above.

My experience was that the gap between my Neptune (similar in size to your PT-7) and my Melton Eb (which is bigger than most F) was too wide and I needed something in between - nicely filled by my PT-20 which is great for most of the kind of works on your earlier list.

There certainly are some great models out there to choose from. I was fortunate enough to get ahold of a great Rudy 5/4 and have not looked back. The older B&S tubas I've tried are great too. The new JBL classics F from B&S is very impressive. It is pricy but so are the Rudy Fs.
The Firebird is a fantastic horn too. From what I understand the 181 Miraphone is being made wth the Firebird valve body now and has helped the pitch alot.
I am eager to try Alan's new Kodiak F as well. Also for your information Walter Nirschl will be coming out with acouple new rotary F tubas in the near future. He is working with a well known german player on these models. However, a new BBb is coming out first.
Having been through 6 F tubas myself in not so many years I'd say the most important thing to do is to take your time. Play everything you can get your hands on and see if you can get it right the first time unlike many of us. What works for some does not for others. You will know when you have gotten your hands on something special.

Good Luck!

Pete

Meinl-Weston 45SLZ or 46SLZ. Big F tuba, but still sounds like an F tuba unlike the Yamaha 822. The 45SLZ/46SLZ also has a nice scale.

The Miraphone Firebird is a bit smaller, but still a fairly large F, and also very well in tune with itself.

To bloke:
Be welcome to try out MY horn. Slight intonation issues ? Maybe. Most of these will be MY fault, not the horn´s. 35 cents ? Never played THAT sharp on 2nd space C (except, maybe, on purpose) while in front of a tuner.

To the original poster:
check out the "Norwegian Star" Eb tuba. (the bigger one). Not that this matters that much, but I truly fell in love with THAT one last April in Frankfurt, Germany.

Hi,

I really can't say enough good things about the Gronitz PF 125 F tuba. If you are looking into the Yamaha 822 then you should give this tuba a serious look because it has a low range that easily rivals the 822, and in my opinion it has a better sound more like that of a German rotary F. If you have any questions about the way one plays or anything like that just pm me and I'll try to answer your questions.

Cheers,

The complaints I've heard about the Yamaha 822 is that the sound is vanilla and difficult to manipulate to suit specific applications. And that it sounds like a small C instead of a large F.

The Willson has the second fault but not the first. Lovely instrument. But it still sounds like a contrabass.

If you want an F tuba that can penetrate a large ensemble and still sound like an F tuba, then it will take a bit different sound concept than you are used to with the PT-7. Instead of an enveloping sound, you'll be searching for clarity and power.

One reason the B&S tubas became the near-standard for F tubas used in orchestras was that it had the clarity and power to penetrate a large ensemble and still sound like a bass tuba rather than a contrabass tuba. And they have an excellent scale, until you get down in that low C range.

I have learned not to be so afraid of the low C on a rotary F. It has some of the same blow issues as the low F on my Holton. You have to really find the resonance in the note and then feed it carefully--trying to shove too much air into it will kill it rather than reinforce it. It's like making a good low F on a trombone.

Since that first B&S (the Symphonie), several makers have tried to work from that concept and improve the low register, including B&S. The Miraphone 181 seems to me cut from that mold, though it's still a very different instrument. It has an excellent bottom end compared to older rotary F's, but at the expense of some of that lovely bass tubas color. All the big rotary F's are trying to find that balance.

But if you want a tuba that plays and sounds like a small contrabass, the Willson is the pick of the litter in my view. For a clear bass tuba sound that can stand up to a large ensemble, the older B&S design still seems the best to my ears, but it requires care and feeding. The Miraphone, newer B&S models, Meinl-Weston 45 and 46 models, and so on, fall in between.

I now play a Yamaha 621 F and an old B&S Symphonie. The Yamaha is too small for large ensembles, which is why I got the B&S.

Rick "who didn't used to like B&S F tubas, either" Denney

Miraphone firebird

From now on, I plan on using a Miraphone 184 CC for an F tuba I'm tired of playing out of tune F tubas