TubeNet

Hey i have a mirafone 186 5uc rotary valve tuba that id like to trade. i want a horn with at least 4 pistons. if anyone has any ideas then let me know. I'd also take around $3500. if anyone is interested let me know. my email is andrewthetubaplayer@yahoo.net.

andrew the tuba player wrote:i want a horn with at least 4 pistons.

Is 6 pistons enough?

well yeah...but, what is it?? Its pretty cool, but i need a good horn to get me though highschoool. I'm also planning on joining the local commutity band and eventually i'[ll need a horn for colledage so, it's have to be good. I need to know like, what key brand size etc. thanks

id like it to be a 4/4 or biggger

andrew the tuba player wrote:well yeah...but, what is it?? Its pretty cool, but i need a good horn to get me though highschoool. I'm also planning on joining the local commutity band and eventually i'[ll need a horn for colledage so, it's have to be good. I need to know like, what key brand size etc. thanks

The picture is a French C tuba, which was the standard instrument in the majority of French orchestras until Mel Culbertson showed up in Paris with a "conventional" CC tuba. The established French C tuba players got miffed, went on strike, and the orchestras merely replaced them with CC players. So almost overnight the horn went from being the standard to being a relic.

Now, THAT's the horn to play Berlioz and Bydlo on. It is actually pitched at C, one step above a standard euph, but has a much larger bore. The purpose of all six valves is similar to an F tuba with six valves, to aid intonation all the way to the pedals, which are (were) routinely used.

so would it be good for what i need?? ive never seen one before. i need a horn thats goood for highschool colladge and church

Heh, I would recommend that you take the post for the French C tuba as a joke and don't purchase one. You won't find much use for it.

Out of curiousity, why do you want to get rid of your 186? I played a BBb Miraphone 186 all through high school until I bought my CC Miraphone 1291 at the end of my senior year and couldn't complain one bit. I haven't played the CC 186, but I'm sure it could do you fine, assuming it's in good shape. It's got 5 valves, so you don't have to worry about low stuff.

I get the feeling you have a preference for pistons and that's the reason for the change?[/code]

yes. i dont have a problem with the horn its self. Its a really nice horn that plays great, i just really like pistons.

Whatd id really like to get ahold of is a conn 2xJ 6/4 BBb tuba with an upright bell. I have a 20k from my school that no one plays. but, none of the band directors like it because it's to straght forward and covers up all but the low brass. (the back row loves it...now the flutes...thats a different story ) Or even just another 6/4 BBb. I like the openess that the 6/4 provides.

I would keep the 186. I haven't had any complaints in the symphony and I have to back way off in the community band. The conductor is not used the the punch that the German horn can deliver. Roger Bobo played a 188 in the Los Angeles Symphony Orchestra and sounded like a tuba god. He even played the smaller 184 in the symphony. You have a great horn, but I guess there are many choices these days. I would have loved to have had a 186 in high school. Shoot, I would have loved one in college too instead of that old MW 25 I rented from the university. If you must have piston valves, the Miraphone 1291 is quite nice.

Eric "who believes one should be more concerned about how he sounds than in how the valves feel".

The horn is cool. I really like it. but, i dont like rotarys as much. They dont feel as smoothe to me. At school its a good horn but for church and things like that i prefer pstons. You are right in that the german horns deliver a punch. my band director (who thought i was to loud before) noticed a differance. Thats another thing. i have to play with a mute in church because its to loud. plus my highschool band is small so, i cant be too over powering. but, the biggest thing i want is pistons. Id really like to have another mirafone but ill take a good piston horn.

The Miraphone 1291 CC has 4 pistons and a 5th rotary. That might fit the bill for you.

but i really want pistons

andrew the tuba player wrote:Thats another thing. i have to play with a mute in church because its to loud.

this seems strange to me.

I don't really think the purpose of a tuba mute is to be quieter....it is more for an "effect"

If you're looking for a horn to do a lot but ALSO be quiet in "solo" small ensemble settings, maybe an Eb is your solution? Or maybe you should keep your horn now for your bands and srping for a 3/4 CC/BBb or maybe a large F horn for church and stuff??

Though, if you want to own only one horn and your community band is "small" then maybe a 3/4CC or Eb will do.

I know a few players in college's who only play on an Eb. Doesn't hold them back too much.

All of these are options of which are better than stuffing in a mute

If your 186 is too loud, then you do NOT need a 6/4 anything!

As Scooby Tuba noted, if you WANT something different, then that's reason enough to BUY something different. I agree with this, as I've bought "something different" more times than I can count (ok, about a dozen over the years) -- rotary and piston, in every key (and in both silver and lacquer )

Having said that ...

If you search the archives (use the "search" link at the top/center of the page) you'll find that the 186CC is universally accepted as a great, do-it-all horn. I've heard a number of college tubists soloing on different horns, and the 186CC ended up with the nicest sound of the group. It's a great, all-purpose tuba. And it's yours ... now!

Years ago, the big-name pro players (some of the more notable ones) played rotary valved tubas, and they were all the rage. Now it's piston valves. Go figure. The horns are all good quality, but there are subtle differences, granted.

If your horn is in decent shape, you have an excellent choice right now. But, for something different in piston and in CC, I would recommend the Miraphone 1292 over the 1291 for improved response (slightly different leadpipe and added bell garland). But these horns have a bigger sound than the 186, imo., if that has caused you difficulties in some settings (be aware).

Another reasonable, "do-it-all" tuba is the Conn 52J CC. It has 4 pistons and a rotary 5th valve. Many tubists I've chatted with think the Conn 52J / 54J / 56J tubas are rather "plain" sounding, however. I like my 56J, but your ears should be the judge.

Check intonation carefully with a tuner for ALL tubas you try out.

If you plan to be a music performance or education major, you should look for a good 4/4 - 5/4 size contrabass, most likely in the key of C. A bass tuba, while typically not having as full of a sound, allowing a less "overpowering" result, may not be what you want as your primary college tuba. (Eb or F tuba)

Look for a used tuba in good condition, as you can likely sell it later (if you wish) and not lose much money.

(BTW, you said the rotors didn't feel as smooth. Rotor valves in good condition should be smooth and easy to play. Could it be that one solution is to keep the horn and ask a competent repair person to check out the valves? Are they "healthy"?)

Random thoughts for your consideration,


(I vote to keep the 186!)

Linkage.

Everyone forgets to have the linkage gone over on a rotor. Lubrication can dry up, being on top of the horn it can get knocked around, and there are more places friction can creep in.

Linkage. Have your linkage checked.

Roger Lewis told me singer sewing machine oil on the rotor bearings and 3-in-1 oil on the linkage.

i did. I took it and my repair man 'the bandsmith' (Craig Heinrich ) said the valves were great. all they needed was to be cleaned which he did. the thing i dont like is that they take so long to "break down". with pistons its just one valve cap and a spring. with rotors its alot more comlicated. this hurts wen youre at a rehearsal and your valves start to stick. and, i like the resoponce of pistons better. the horn is great. Just, not quite what i want.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but assuming the valves are in good condition, they shouldn't stick if they are being used regularly...

i gotta be the devil's advocate it seems.

If you want pistons, get pistons.

I personally have great disdain for rotors, mainly because I don't like the slurring action in comparison to pistons.

however, you REALLY DON'T NEED A 6/4!

I own a Gronitz PCK, there are times when I'm incredibly thankful for it's size, and times when I truly regret not having bought a PT-6 (which was my second choice) (well, in all honesty I wanted a nirschl but couldn't find one....)