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Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:47 am**

I am about to start my senior year of high school and have started the college searching process. For the most part, all of the college tuba teachers I have met with strongly feel that their students should switch over to CC before the end of their freshman year. I currently play a BBb Mirafone 186, however I am interested in starting to look around for CC horns, even though I will probably wait and pick out a horn with my teacher. What are good all around CC horns that could be used for a Wind Ensemble, Symphony Orchestra, Quintet, and solo setting. I figured definately check out the CC version of the Mirafone 186, but any other suggestions? My list of what I would like to try is Mirafone 1291, Meinl Weston 2155, and Hirsbrunner HB-2. Does anyone have any suggestions or strong disagreements?

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:51 am**

Miraphone 188-5 CC

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 1:46 am**

I was thinking something a little larger than my 186....does that seem like a good idea, or would it be too big in quintet and solo settings? Obviously....it does vary with certain horns.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:30 am**

that all depends on how well you can control the horn. I've only ever heard of one person using a large horn in a small ensemble. and that would be Mr. Pokorney (might be mistaken). but you should be fine with any 4/4 horn. I use a Kalison D.S., it looks and feels like a large 4/4 horn, but IMO it plays and sounds like a large 3/4. I would also sugguest the PT-606 and the HB-21. they IMO are two of the most amazing 4/4 piston horns ever made.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:34 am**

for what its worth, here is what I think:

I tried out the 2155 when I was trying out the Miraphone 1291. It costs several thousand dollars more and does not play as well. The 2155s I played when I was on the hunt for my tuba (miraphone 1291, by the way) were stuffy and didn't center as well as I felt they should have. I wanted a big open sound, and the 2155 did not deliver. I think the 1291 is a much more versatile tuba. With the right mouthpiece it can sound at home in any ensemble.

I cannot speak for the hirsbrunner, but I have heard very mixed reviews regarding its playing characteristics. It will, however, be MUCH more expensive than either the MW or the Miraphone.

Check out some perantucci tubas if you have the chance. My buddy plays a PT-6P and he likes it a lot. I have also heard good things about some conn tubas.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:37 am**

The Hirsbrunner is a great horn, (hell, it suited Gene Pokorny just fine.) Also, if you can find one, try and play some Rudolf-Meinl horns, specifically the 4/4, (more like a 5/4) horn.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:08 am**

I would give serious consideration to Jeff Rice's Yamaha 861 in Los Angeles. I tried it out and was impressed. It's a great tuba, especially for the price. Here's the link: viewtopic.php?t=21535&highlight=

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:20 am**

I too, favor an HB-2. I have one, which I feel possesses a great sound, and is very flexible.

In the past, I have read comments about Hirsbrunners, that have puzzled me.

Perhaps there are significant differences between their piston & rotary horns, but the HB-2 is a great axe!

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:43 pm**

I suggest you check this out.

viewtopic.php?p=190051#190051

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:21 pm**

Do not buy a tuba until you have decided absolutely, 100%, without question where you will be attending college and with whom you will be studying. If buy tuba X based on the sage advice given on this board, you are likely to find that your future teacher prefers tuba Y. You will then feel compelled to sell tuba X and a loss in order to buy tuba Y. This will make you and whomever finances your tuba purchases very unhappy.

Learn to play the snot out of your 186 BBb over the next few months and when you meet with the professors on your short list, make it known that you intend to buy a CC tuba before your first semester and ask THEIR advice. It will save you much aggravation not to mention many $$$$.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:36 pm**

Meinl Weston 2155

Meinl Weston 6450 "Baer"

Meinl Weston 5450 "Thor"

Wilson 3050S

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 5:14 pm**

MW 2145 with the tweaks from the Baltimore Brass Company. They take a horn that never really interested me and make them into excellent horns.

Miraphone 188. Quite possibly one of the best all-around tubas ever made.

Miraphone 1291. Excellent horns but some of them seem to have intonation issues. Some, however, do not and are excellent.

Getzen CB-50 / G-50. Not in production anymore, hard to find but excellent all-around horn and very well suited for undergrad work

Best advice I can give you is to get with your private teacher and discuss this at length. Try playing the horns side by side and see which ones play well for and you sound good playing. That last point is key - you can like playing the horn all day long but if you don't sound good on it then it's not serving it's purpose.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:15 pm**

Ed Jones wrote:Do not buy a tuba until you have decided absolutely, 100%, without question where you will be attending college and with whom you will be studying. If buy tuba X based on the sage advice given on this board, you are likely to find that your future teacher prefers tuba Y. You will then feel compelled to sell tuba X and a loss in order to buy tuba Y. This will make you and whomever finances your tuba purchases very unhappy.

Learn to play the snot out of your 186 BBb over the next few months and when you meet with the professors on your short list, make it known that you intend to buy a CC tuba before your first semester and ask THEIR advice. It will save you much aggravation not to mention many $$$$.

My plan is to try some horns ahead of time to get an idea and a feel for what I like and don't like, and then discuss it with my teacher.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:03 pm**

A 4/4 Nirschl has just been posted in the For Sale. This design is a highly tweaked Bohm & Meinl which was based on the Marzans, which were darn good 4/4+ horns.
Might be worth checking out.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:12 am**

I know I'm old school, but I still say a GOOD Piggy (emphasis quite intentional and even more important) is better than all of those as an all-round horn.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 7:59 am**

bloke wrote:Mirafone 1291 - serious intonation issues

Care to explain?

Mine has only one "serious" intonation issue: The d in the staff is flat, (it requires me to push in about an inch to an inch and a half on the first valve slide. Hardly earth shattering) and the g-a at the top are slightly off as well (sharp), but not horribly so. These notes are easily fixed with careful preparation and sliding. I think the notes at the top of the staff being out of tune are more due to my tendency to over blow those notes.

from what I have heard and experienced, the 1291 CC is a very easy horn to play in tune. If I compromise slide positions I can get away with never moving my slides on most notes.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:40 am**

tuben wrote:
tubashaman wrote: Bloke, I play on the 1291 and I dont have tuning issues, it depends on the player.
Here is the thing,
1 - Not every one wants to make the adjustments necessary to make an out of tune tuba (Alexander/old MW 2155/etc) play in tune.

2 - Not every one has the ABILITY to make an out of tune tuba play in tune.

This is a matter of the ability of the player to listen and force an out of tune tuba work. I know both of my tubas are out of tune (the MW is very good, but a few squirely notes), and I also know what I need to push/pull to make them work.

Bloke was exactly correct in his assessment of the basic pitch of those instruments. That's not to say they can not be played in tune, they just take more effort than other models.

Robert Coulter
(who tunes so much he now hears the beats in an equal temperament chord)

Exactly. If I wanted to play trombone, I have a very, very nice late HN White King 3B. And we all know the Porkorny quote that you pull for tone, not tuning. True, but I don't play orchestra, either. If I got an orchestra gig, I'd be lapping slides to optimum and getting my left hand in gear to keep up with the wire choir.

The one thing I do pull for is my souzy modification, since it lays right there at the left hand with three valves.

BTW -- I can hear the beats in equally tempered chords also -- both the slight "chorusing" beats of the slightly tempered 5ths as well as the ringers on the major 3rds. Mine from years of setting up guitars as a hobby and also helping a regional organ tech when he made his rounds to the area, now retired.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:31 am**

All tubas,and all brass instruments,and yes probably even all musical instruments are out of tune.They have to be played in tune.It's a matter of getting one as close as possible to in tune.The Thor,though the best horn I've ever owned by far,still has some issues, with me playing it.They are modest problems and the adjustments needed are the smallest I've had to make on any horn i've owned.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 10:52 am**

MartyNeilan wrote:A 4/4 Nirschl has just been posted in the For Sale. This design is a highly tweaked Bohm & Meinl which was based on the Marzans, which were darn good 4/4+ horns.
Might be worth checking out.

Posted: **Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:33 pm**

Is it going to be hard to grasp how a CC horn plays if I have only played BBb before, or will it still give me a general idea?....I'm not quite sure what to expect

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