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Does anyone have any suggestions on playing the high G# in Bydlo?

fatemokid wrote:Does anyone have any suggestions on playing the high G# in Bydlo?

In the event he is legit:

Work up to it.
Play one octave scales up slowly, slurred, starting from your tuning note or a 4th below. Play each scale two or three times, then when the top notes are clean move on to the next one. You may only get up to middle C, D, or E the first few attempts. Practice these around MF - too loud and you will blow out your chops prematurely in the practice session, too soft and the higher notes might not speak as you are developing that range. Try to add a half step to the range every few days. Go for quality over quantity, and do not press too hard to get the higher notes - use the same amount of mouthpiece pressure (ie virtually none) as you do in the low range. You may want to have a tuner in front of you because the higher notes are probably going to be all over the place at first. (You can also have a drone tone for the top note instead.) After that regimen, take a 10 minute break and then play pentascales (1-2-3-4-5-4-3-2-1-2-3-4-5-4-3-2-1-2-3-4-5) and hold out the top note until you run out of breath or the sound cracks. Start on your tuning note and work your way up to your useable top note as with the previous exercise.

I used a similar regimen in high school to be able to nail the VW F's and Ab's. I am going through one right now to lock in the high register on the Kali-Bat about 5 days a week for the past two weeks. Right now, I am starting my exercises on C in the staff (tuning C for my CC) and ending around G or Ab abover the staff. That is where the clear sound ends. I hope to someday make it to the C above middle C. My biggest concern now is locking down the pitch - two weeks ago it was all over the place above the staff but it is getting very close now as I learn the horn and get my chops back in shape. The infamous middle C on the 2001 Kali is now being played in tune with the 1st valve pushed most of the way in - open is still beyond use and will probably remain so. All other upper register fingerings do not stray from the norm.

I'm playin bydlo in feb. with the Texas Tech orchestra at the TMEA convention. SCALES SCALES SCALES. Really just playing up there all the time (balanced with low register playing of course). The whole secret is to be comfortable in that range. If you really want to be comfortable work it up in the keys below working up by half steps until you can play the b flat and even c above the bydlo g#. It takes time so don't get frustrated. Keep going it'll come with time.

Use an F, then switch back to a C for the Catacombs

If you have to ask how to play the g#, give it to the trombonist next to you.

The one holding the euph.





In all seriousness, if you don't have the range, and if you are doing more than practicing the excerpt, let another play it. If this is not the case, practice scalar passages in the higer tessitura that take you BEYOND the g#...Only in this way will you be able to "slot" the pitch. Also work on that P5 (c# to g#) interval in the lower octaves until it is engrained in your head.

Then pray.

Good luck!

AVC

porkchopsisgood wrote:...give it to the trombonist next to you.

In all seriousness, this is probably the best advice (and the advice NO ONE wants to hear...)

I'm sure you have listened to Pokorny's excerpt CD. He brings up a very valid point: once you have the job (in this case, you are already in the orchestra), set aside the ego and ask whether you or a tacet trombone player (on euph) can be more MUSICAL with it.

If you do decide to play it, then make sure you are not just practicing up to the G#. There have been some excellent ideas posted above, but above all, don't let G# be the "top" of your range. If it is, it will SOUND like your highest note (which probably isn't a very musical sound.)

Again, I emphasize whether you should even play it. Have any tuba players ever played it on euph? Why isn't this option discussed more often?

Edited for grammar. (Thanks Windshieldbug)

I played bydlo with the WT orchestra last year. Keep in mind that bydlo was written for a French C tuba. As previously said, playing on an F would probably be your best bet. You would have much more control in that high register than on a C. Some people also cheat and play it on a euphonium. Like bigbear said, the best way to be able to play up to it is to be comfortable in that range. The only way to be comfortable is to play in that range.

I'll give you a good practice tip that really made it easy for me. Try and play it...then play it on your mouthpeice, glissing between all the notes, making sure there aren't any skips in your buzzing. Then try on the instrument...then the mouthpeice...then the instrument again untill it's smooth. That excersice has made the difference in my legato playing and I'm sure it'll work for you. Remember, if you can play it on your mouthpiece, you can play it on your horn. Good luck!

When Tiger Woods feels his driver isn't working he goes down to a strong 2 iron that he calls his "chicken stick" - meaning that he is chickening out because the other club isn't working that day.

Hand the part off to the euphonium player. Or learn it on euphonium yourself. If your G# sounds like a blue jay farting in an empty silo, then you shouldn't be doing this on tuba. I would rather let someone else, experienced on euphonium, do the solo.

The last time I did Pictures I had the Yorkbrunner, my F and (the chicken stick) my euph with cheater mouthpiece all on stage with me. When Bydlo came up, I reached for the horn that I KNEW I could nail it on - that time it was the F. The time before it was the euph with the cheater mouthpiece.

Remember, there's no glory in screwing up.

Just my worthless to the Euro $0.02

Roger

The C sharp to G sharp interval for this is a bit flat on the euphonium. I once kew an old tuba player who cut the first valve slide down to get it in tune - worked for him so I did the same on my horn. Works fir me, I push it in all the way for the Bydlo, pull it out a bit for every thing else.

sc_curtis wrote:Has any tuba players [sic] ever played it on euph? Why isn't this option discussed more often?

I've done it on euphonium, because as Roger says, "there's no glory in screwing up". But I much prefer to use my 6/4 Melton F. I love the sound, and I don't care if it WAS written for a "French" C.

Why isn't it discussed more? Because there are also a whole lot of trombone players licking their chops from the time they hear "Ravel"...

sc_curtis wrote:Has any tuba players ever played it on euph? Why isn't this option discussed more often?

Discussed more often than what? It's thoroughly discussed here every few months, it seems.

I have heard pros play it using a euphonium. Some have screwed it up on that instrument. I've also heard pros screw it up on an F. These are guys that have the range, evidenced by relatively painless execution of Symphonie Fantastique, for example, which goes up to a Bb.

If pros have those sorts of troubles, that tells me where I am. (I can't reliably play that high Bb in SF.) If I had the opportunity to play it, and I couldn't pass it to a trombonist, I would use a euphonium in a heartbeat. I'd rather have the thin low euph sound in the middle accompaniment part than a splattered high G# in an exposed solo.

Something about it makes it intimidating, especially the piano entrance on the high G# near the end of the movement. Treat it with respect.

Rick "rarely asked to play notes within half an octave of that G#" Denney

I Like using 5th valve on my F horn

The original question: How to play it?

5-1 on F; or 2, or 2-3
1 on Eb
1 on euphonium
23 on CC
1 or 0 or 1-2 or 1-2-3 on BBb

Roger Lewis wrote: If your G# sounds like a blue jay farting in an empty silo, then you shouldn't be doing this on tuba. Roger

One word.....wow....

Rick Denney wrote:

sc_curtis wrote:Has any tuba players ever played it on euph? Why isn't this option discussed more often?

Discussed more often than what?

I'm sure some people have done it, I was wondering if anyone had specific examples and/or stories about the tooba player playing it on euph, instead of a tromboner.

It seems most discussions revolve around people either playing it on F or passing it off. If given the choice, I would try it on a euph, and if it sucked, pass it off. Just because I CAN play it on F, doesn't mean I SHOULD.

Edit for spelling.

Sometimes you can't just "pass it off" to one of the trombone players. I once was in a situation where none of the trombonists were willing to play it. I played, but wished someone else would have played it. Also, if it is a paying gig, what if the management is not willing to pay doubling for one of the trombone players to play euph?

There are plenty of euph players that would love to play this with an orchestra, go get/hire one of us!


And its not "cheating." The euphonium more resembles the instrument that part was written for than any tuba.

sc_curtis wrote:I'm sure some people have done it, I was wondering if anyone had specific examples and/or stories about the tooba player playing it on euph, instead of a tromboner.

I played Pictures with an amateur orchestra a few years ago and played Bydlo on euphonium, because it sounded much better that way. I did offer it to the trombone players but it turned out that I felt more at home with the euph than any of them.

On many rotary F tubas (B & S, some Miraphones that I've tried) that note works very nicely with 5th valve only.

One option to try, FWIW.