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You should not need copius amounts of oil on your valves. A dot or two on the spindles (under the back caps and at the point where the shaft enters the cap on the front side) every week or so is all it should take. Actually, the only point where the rotors should be touching is at the spindle shafts. Oil down the lead pipe doesn't do much for lubrication but only serves to seal the rotors. Closely fit rotors and lots of oil tends to make the rotors sluggish. There may be some residues left from the manufacturing process that need to be cleaned out. Lighten up on the oil for a while and if the problem persists take it to a repairman (or back where you bought it). To properly clean out the valves, they need to be taken apart but you might have some luck running warm water through the leadpipe while the main tuning slide is removed. I said WARM ... NOT HOT!

Another thing to consider- not all oils co-exist peaceably. Some oils will actually form a sticky sludge-like material when mixed.

Dan's right on the mark with the "run warm water through the horn" suggestion. My suspicion is that there's debris (maybe left over from manufacturing)that's being flushed into your valves after you've been playing the horn. In a tight-tolerance horn, it doesn't take much--a human hair can jam a valve.

A trombone snake and some water run through the slides and leadpipe should help matters out some. Eventually, you'll want to learn to clean your own valves, but for now, try the warm (not HOT, maybe with a little dishwashing detergent in it) water through the innards, use the trombone snake to clean out the leadpipe, flush with clear water and see if that doesn't help things.

Try using Marvel Mystery Oil on your valves. You can pick it up at any auto parts store. Work the oil in until it gets sluggy, playing the horn for about 10 minutes, and then apply Al Cass or some other premium valve oil. Marvel Mystery Oil has a detergent in it that gets rid of any deposits that may be in the valves. Alan Baer taught me this trick 15 years ago and it has kept my valves fast and clean ever since.

DON"T USE BLUE JUICE!!
It's awful and corrodes so I've heard. Use three-in-one oil and break the valves in!

treddle wrote: How about it Allora? Step up to the plate...

Do you really expect the same performance from the Allora as you would expect from Mirafone?

treddle wrote:You are an instrument repair guy. You know the instruments better than I. I think we need Allora to reply to this discussion. How about it Allora?

Allora is NOT a manufacturer. Allora is a brand sold by The Brasswind of which different instruments are made by different manufacturers. The Brasswind and their partner who made the horn should stand by their product. My experience with the Brasswind in tha past indicates that they do generally take care of their customers.

The first step to take is to call them and give them the opportunity to rectify the situation.

Lew wrote:The first step to take is to call them and give them the opportunity to rectify the situation.

I certainly have to agree with that statement regardless whether we are talking about an Allora or a Mirafone. One of the benifits of buying a horn from a bona-fide dealer is that you can actually call WWBW and speak to a REAL salesperson.... (even if they do just ask you to run warm water through the horn, take two aspirin, and call in the morning if the problem persists!).

Gary Swart wrote:Me thinks before I demanded an exchange or refund, I'd at least try the remedies suggested. In a perfect world, there would be no residue to clean out, a proper lubication would be all that was necessary. However, we all know we don't live in a perfect world, so try the warm water and detergent. If that fails, have a qualified repairman disassemble the rotors and inspect them. Perhaps they need to be honed, perhaps they need better cleaning, or perhaps he will tell you they are not properly made. In the latter case, by all means contact the dealer. If the problem is easily remedied, then do what needs to be done.

Having the dealer rectify the situation doesn't necessarily mean a refund or exchange. It does mean to tell them what the problem is and have them make an offer as to how to deal with it. Having a qualitifed repairperson look at the horn and do any of the things you mentioned will cost money. They are reasonable things to have done, but the buyer shouldn't have to pay for them. The Brasswind has repair people who could inspect the rotors and they should do so for no charge.

Tubist of Time wrote:After examining the problem more closely, I think it is more of a mechanical problem, rather than something like gunk in the valves, need oiling/cleaning, etc. The two problem valves are the 2nd and 3rd. The other two work fine. For the second one, it doesn't really "stick" you just can't push it in. And when you do, it takes a lot of effort. I'm not sure about the third, it may just need cleaning. When I hold the horn toward me and press the valves, they work fine. I've seemed to notice that the angle at which I hold the horn affects the valve function. Perhaps the valve is mis-aligned. Any ideas?

I was going to tell you about when I went from an old, leaky horn to a new, tight one and used heavy oil on the spindles and the valves just about ground to a halt; I had to flush it with lighter fluid. Since then I sucessfully use blue juice on it.

But yes this does sound positional; you really should be on the phone to the vendor about this. Shipping would be another concern, but when you buy mail order it's something you know you may have to deal with. A good flushing just may fix it, and may not. Many Holton French horns, in the past, arrived with valves that were TOO tight and had to be lapped before they would work right. They worked fine at the very beginning but then started to lock up. I've seen others that had construction grunk in them that was near impossible to get out....you'd wash it out, then two days later more grunk would be in the valves.

MA

treddle wrote:Ok guys, we pay a lot of hard earned cash for these things. There are not too many other musicians that have to fork out as much as we do.

Ask an orchestral string player how much they paid for their instrument or a pianist how much their piano cost them...it puts things in perspective.

I think the first thing that anyone should do in this situation is to give me a call. We have a VERY liberla trial period of 45 days on just about everything we sell, including the Allora tubas. If there is a problem (possibly a warped back valve plate or something to that efgfect) we should get that instrument back. We'll evben pay the shipping on mechanical problems.

Our repair crew will correct the problem and get it back to you promptly - or give you a refund toward something else or just a refund if you are completely unhappy with our service and support. I think you need to give us a chance to prove that we can correct this for you.

I hadn't read this thread before so I didn't realize that is was about an Allora instrument. Sorry

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