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Bob1062 wrote:...when I am playing my unit's 186...?

Congratulations!!!!!

Bob1062 wrote: And as to the MF4, is this "merely" a shallower Bach 18? I love my 18 (and really love the rim) in most contrabasses and in big Eb's, but I would be interested in something shallower. I tried my 25 for a while in my Eb's, but didn't take to the rim size very well. So now it is going off with my last Eb.

Does this picture help you with the rim shape of an MF4? I know that the MF4 and MF2 have the same rim. I think the MF2 has a similar inner shape to a Bach 18. Maybe the rim is similar also.

tubashaman wrote:wanna fight cjk.........I know about the bach 7. The first 2 mouthpiece i owned (and still have) are a bach 7 and bach 18. I have played on a bach 24AW before as well

Or cjk, are you just a tubenet jerk without a gig

**ROTFLMAO**

Doing some eye-balling and a little measuring, I'd say the 7 is about 0.5mm wider inside than the 12. But the 12 has a wider rim. I mean the external diameter is wider -- not just wider because there is more left on the inside. Me myself haven't noticed any real advantage to the low end with the 7. The 12 is big enough and with a big enough throat that it covers the low stuff nicely. The 12 is on my short list. If you can't bark like a big dog with a 12, then you ain't gonna bark with a 7. However, I'm still partial to the PT44 these days. Kellyberg is good too. I finally got me a glitter gold one.

And for the 30E: It measures pretty close internally to the Yamaha 64. The 64 has a wider rim (or the 30E has a narrower rim). Now, if you can get your hands on a 64 ...

Dunno if this helps, but here's the Bach chart with cup dimensions.


(borrowed from here: http://accessories.conn-selmer.com/pdf/bachmouth.pdf" target="_blank" target="_blank )

tubashaman wrote:wanna fight cjk.........I know about the bach 7. The first 2 mouthpiece i owned (and still have) are a bach 7 and bach 18. I have played on a bach 24AW before as well
Or cjk, are you just a tubenet jerk without a gig

Calm down, James. When are you going to learn to respond calmly. Don't you think others have been less than thrilled by someone's response. You make yourself an easy target because of your quickness to not only be offended, but to respond with something similar to what you posted above. If cjk is a "tubenet jerk," as you have accused him of being, I can assure you he isn't the only one. In fact, he isn't the only one to post on this topic. And, if he is without a gig, it seems to me he isn't the only one on TubaNet about which this is true. I believe you have, yourself, documented this. Why don't you try taking your time in responding to things you find offensive. Learn to make your responses more measured and carefully crafted. If that is not an option, try not responding at all.

And just to set the record straight, I am not trying to pick a fight with you. I am merely offering a few suggestions. Take 'em or leave 'em.

If it helps define things a little better: The 7 rim is a little narrower than the 18 rim. The width of the 7 is very close to that of the Conn 120S (Helleberg). But the curvature of the 7 is "similar" to the 18.

About a year ago I got to try an MF4. If I were an Eb soloist, it would be the mouthpiece: great intonation, great consistency of tone, doesn't take a lot of air.

At the same time I had a newer Bach 18 I was considering.

To me, the rim width was about the same. What got me was that the 18 is rather flat, but without the inner edge "bite." (it was a newer one, not a Mt Vernon type with the slope away rim, like a tuba version of a 7C rim, but more like a tuba version of a 3C rim)

The MF4, OTOH, was really curved. It almost felt to me like I had an "O" ring against my embouchure. Not good, not bad. Just different.

That's from playing both side by side with a serious view to keeping one or the other, even though I did eventually let go of both in favor of my current mouthpieces in my signature, for the ensemble nature of what I play.

I grew-up playing a Bach 18 with its "soft edge" rim....great mouthpiece!
I have played and like the MF4 and it has a very-very-similar edge as the Bach 18.

If I was still playinga bass tuba (pea-shooter F), I would be using the MF4H. I currently prefer the MF3H for contrabass.

I don't have a cross-section of the Bach 18 to compaie to the MF photos. But the Bach 18 and the MF3 & MF4 have similar rims, but different diameters

One thing to notice about the last few posts: when describing the various Bach 18 mouthpieces each poster has played, you will note that if you abstract the descriptions of each, you wouldn't know you were talking about the same mouthpiece. Bach is so inconsistent from year to year and mouthpiece to mouthpiece, it's almost comical.

For example, there have been at least three different rims described and 3 different cup widths described all within five posts.