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My tongue makes contact with my lips when tongueing sometimes, especially in the low register. On into the middle and high registers it moves to a true D or T sound.

I don't see it as a problem- if it sounds good when you do it and doesn't have bad side effects, I say go right ahead.

schlepporello wrote:...I've never been able to double tongue...

I'll bet with a little practice you can. Start out by saying tu-ku or du-gu or whatever slowly. Gradually increase the speed. Don't even try to do it on the tuba. Just say it.

It seems for a lot of people, there is an initial struggle with double tonguing, then suddenly they can do it. So be persistent.

Once you can say it at a good speed, try doing it on the tuba. Again, be persistent. Just practice on a single note. Don't try to coordinate note/valve changes at first.

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I always tongue against the roof of my mouth, just behind my front teeth, like many of the others noted. Since you mentioned it, I tried tonguing against my lips and find that it disturbs my buzz and I can't keep a consistent tone that way. It also makes it next to impossible for me to double tongue.

I usually have no trouble double tonguing, and need to because I can't tongue nearly fast enough otherwise. Tonguing against my lips does appear to be much faster. It actually feels like making the same motion as double tonguing. When double tonguing I close off the air with the front of my tongue behind my front teeth, alternating with using the back of my tongue against the roof of my mouth. If I try tonguing against my lips the back of my tongue is too far away from the roof of my mouth for that alternate motion to work.

Say the word "tah" or "toe"... notice where your tongue is for speaking, and that may also be a good place for it while playing. The position may also change (unconsciously) when you play with a different sound or range, but don’t worry about it.

Above all, do something which comes naturally, because it is best not to be tying your tongue in knots and thinking of all these things while you're trying to play music.

Seems most everyone tries to control the tongue as muscle. I knew a teacher who advocated contoling the tongue by speech. Take a look at

http://www.windsongpress.com/video/tong ... 0intro.wmv

You better have a high speed connection and Windows Media Player!

brianf wrote:Seems most everyone tries to control the tongue as muscle.

I was just about to say the same thing! I'll follow the link in a minute, but I want to type while I've got the thought fresh in my head...

Say every sound that is remotely like "tah", "dah", "thah", even "sah" -- all the s, t, d, th, and other variants. Just for a minute, notice how each sound puts your tongue in a different place.

They're all unique -- and you don't have to concentrate on your tongue to make it happen. They're just speech.

I have the largest tongue of anyone I have ever known or seen. Not only is it long and can easily touch my nose or go under my chin, but it is also wide as a bus. It has created issues for me when double and triple tonging but Tommy Johnson helped me through that way back in college. I do a light tapping at the top of my teeth.

I also had the problem of free air flow when I was in high school partially attributed to my large tongue. I taught myself how to keep it down and out of the way. Breathing steam on a mirror helped me to feel the proper position to keep from sufficating on my own tongue.

I have the largest tongue of anyone I have ever known or seen. Not only is it long and can easily touch my nose or go under my chin, but it is also wide as a bus. It has created issues for me when double and triple tonging but Tommy Johnson helped me through that way back in college. I do a light tapping at the top of my teeth.

I also had the problem of free air flow when I was in high school partially attributed to my large tongue. I taught myself how to keep it down and out of the way. Breathing steam on a mirror helped me to feel the proper position to keep from sufficating on my own tongue.

Did you take that picture just for us??

Great pix, what would you think if was in the Jacobs Tongue Presentation??

They would have loved that in Australia!

tjs wrote:Did you take that picture just for us??

No way. The pic was taken a few years back.

mandrake wrote: You're probably trying to say that it doesn't matter where it happens, so long as the point gets out, which is what I was thinking, and I'm glad that at least two others say so as well.

I was hoping to say that you already know how to position your tongue numerous ways, and it's all under the guise of speech, which you've known long before you started playing an instrument. Just find the right syllables to envision, and your tongue will know what to do.

It's the same kind of thing Jacobs keeps saying -- the body has grown to do many complex things without any conscious effort on your part. For example, if we had to consciously breathe, a whole lot of us would just plain forget, and we'd suffocate.

Jazz & swing bands (the good ones, anyway) are real sticklers for uniform articulation. Using different syllables can change the "feel" of a lick entirely, so to sound like a strongly cohesive group -- and get the musical point across -- everyone needs to agree on what scat-singing syllables to put through their instruments.

I think you should just cut your tongue out and replace with with a sewed on leather sock.

We talk alot about "tah" and "dah, "toh" and "doh", and they are supposedly important as far as brass playing concepts go. However, my wife (a speech pathologist) told me the only difference between the T and D sounds is vocalization.

Meaning, with a "D" sound the vocal cords begin to vibrate before our tongue is released, whereas a "T" syllable requires the release of the tongue before the vocal cords vibrate. The tongue position is the same, in theory, for both.

Just something to think about.