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I have no idea if you've actually played examples of the instruments you listed so I don't know how solid your list really is. To me, the most obvious omissions are Rudy Meinl's 4345 CC and the Alexander 4/4 CC (163?). Also, I don't know what to make of your comments about the Besson 995 CC. I have two students that have bought this horn in the past year and both are thrilled with the horns. Both horns played really well (Thanks to Mike at BBC!) and both students still own those horns and are using them as their main horn. I'm with you on the HB line, they just aren't my cup of tea. Have you looked at the Willson CC? It's a bit larger than most 4/4 CC tubas but not really a 6/4 horn.

For my money, among the 4/4 horns I've played, it's hard to beat the RM 4345 and the Besson 995 for relative bang for the buck. The newer RMs even have a better intonation profile than the older ones, at least the ones I've personally played. As long as you put yourself in a position to play all those horns you listed, it shouldn't be too hard to pick the one the really fits you.

If you are talking about piston CC's:

I have to go with a used Nirschl 4/4. I recently played one and was highly and surprisingly, impressed.

The new Miraphone 1291 is extremely good, I feel much better about them than the Conn 5x-J's right now.

I can't speak about the BBb pistons on the market.

I LOVE MY MIRAPHONE 1291!!! GIVE IT A SHOT!!

PhilW. wrote:I would personally go with the Miraphone 1291, but that is because it definetely has the most bang for the buck. I have never played a MW 2000 or the B&S 606, but I hear that the 606 is not as good as claimed at Custom Music. I wouldn't get a Willson, because those aren't really 4/4 horns, and they have a lot of resistance. Oh, and the fact that they are really expensive puts them out of the picture for me.

Where did you "hear" this about the 606? I think you should check it out. I have played all the horns listed in the "4/4" area and found the 606 the best horn by far. Also, realize that if you call a 2000 a "4/4", the 606 should, by my ear and eye, be called a 5/4. This instrument is fantastic. It takes everything you want to give it. The low end is the best I have encountered on any piston instrument. This includes my (government owned) Nirschl 6/4. Not as cheap as a Miraphone, not as expensive as a 2000, just a fantastic horn that can do it all in grand fashion. Please message me if you want any more first-hand opinion about this instrument.

Cameron Gates

TubaGrandad wrote:Yeah, I left out HB's but I never got on with those for scale and sound-color. Did I just never play a good one?

I am a little mystified by the opinions expressed about the Hirsbrunner horns. While I have not played the piston versions, the HB-2's that I have played, have all been wonderful instruments! Perhaps the piston horns are not on the same high level, I don't know.

Can anyone who has played both comment?

"The 606 only had a really solid low register to him, and he didn't think it would work for small ensemble or solo work."

I disagree. The 606 high end is as good as the low. In and above the staff this horn can crank with color. Also, I found it as easy to get around on at any dynamic than any of the CC's mentioned. If your friend thought it "only had a really solid low register" that's ok, try it for yourself and see. The people I know who have played this instrument all comment about the ease of the middle and high range as well as the monster low range. I should also mention that all of these people have full-time tuba playing jobs. I really respect their opinions.

"Besides, I think that the Custom Music website is a bit melodramatic about the horn:

""The "B & S" Perantucci PT-606P has legendary qualities: ones that are obvious from the first notes played or heard. It is enticing and exciting to play. It tempts one to unleash its strength, the sound is more than strong, and it can "shake the walls". Above all, the instrument has unique
character and true personality.""

I can see your point. The fact that I agree with the write-up does not make me want to stop rolling my eyes a little. Custom is in the business of selling tubas. If this ad gives them even one sale, more power to them. Put yourself in their position: you have a new instrument in your stable and you need to sell it to make your business run. Most of the potential buyers don't have the option of driving to Detroit after work and trying it out. You feel that if they did, they would buy your product. Should you announce with great fanfare that you have an exciting new instument the way they do on their website or just sit on them hoping word of mouth does the trick? If I could write, my report on the horn would be very similar. The statement "It is enticing and exciting to play" is 100% right on the money for me. I simply love this instrument and all of it's capabilities.

Cameron Gates