TubeNet

I have posted on here before. But my post was flagged for some reason, and I beg you not to delete it this time.

Jared Riley is a euphonium player in Columbia, Missouri and a little more than a year ago scammed me out of my Besson Prestige. Since then two businesses have contacted me about similar situations. Jared contacts you about purchasing horns, gives fake credit card numbers, and will not give them back. If you want specific details or if you have come across this individual please contact me. I am building a case against him, as are the businesses involved, but I am trying help by preventing this from happening again.

Please, please do not do business with Jared D. Riley or you will get burned.

Daniel Ord
206-715-8856
dord04@gmail.com" target="_blank

dord04 wrote:I have posted on here before. But my post was flagged for some reason, and I beg you not to delete it this time.

Jared Riley is a euphonium player in Columbia, Missouri and a little more than a year ago scammed me out of my Besson Prestige. Since then two businesses have contacted me about similar situations. Jared contacts you about purchasing horns, gives fake credit card numbers, and will not give them back. If you want specific details or if you have come across this individual please contact me. I am building a case against him, as are the businesses involved, but I am trying help by preventing this from happening again.

Please, please do not do business with Jared D. Riley or you will get burned.

Daniel Ord
206-715-8856
dord04@gmail.com

The TubeNet mobilises rather strongly in cases of theft and burglary. Fine and well so. It is more scary, when scammers come from within our own, after all quite small, population segment.

Some years ago the TubeNet saw a student selling tubas at a higher rate than a normal turnover for students working their way through various tubas in their hunt for the ideal one. I know of a present student dealing in tubas, because he is good at finding them in odd places. I have bought 3 tubas and a couple of other instruments from him. If he can support his studies that way, then OK with me.

The problem with the guy announcing on TubeNet some years ago was that the tubas he sold belonged to his university. He had access to them qua his enrolment as a student. That was a major breach of trust and created some uproar on the old TubeNet. After a period that guy started posting here again. He was not welcomed very warmly and disappeared.

Some TubeNetter’s have stretched their budgets to acquire their instruments. Loosing them through theft or dishonesty is a disaster for them, as replacements will be hard to get.

Any low brass’er close to the funny guys should freeze them out and not consider them friends. That is our strongest legal tool.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

The reason I have brought this into the open is that I have had several buisnesses find me and contact me about what this guy has done to them. I am only trying to help someone in the future out by warning them in advance. The tuba/euphonium world is very small and I wouldn't post this if it wasn't the truth. Like the previous poster said, I have a repuation too and I wouldn't want to ruin it.

Daniel

Jared Riley took me for a couple hundred bucks at a show a few years back. He IS bad news, everyone should avoid him and he deserves all the bad rap that he is getting. While I do not like seeing a player's reputation ruined, this is an exception. Sean, please keep this thread up - Jared chose to steal from the tuba community, he deserved to find out how small a world this is.

I, for one, appreciate the warning.

Then again, I have met the original poster, and would take him on his word.


What reason would he have to lie? Remember, he didn't have to warn anyone at all.

Ah. Public decorum and professionalism comments when it comes to identifying a thief whose information is public knowledge.

The irony.

I'm very sorry to hear of your story, I cannot imagine how badly that must hurt. I think the original post is entirely appropriate, and appreciate the warning.

Thanks,

Cam

Adam Peck wrote:The original post is inappropriate. Period. There are other ways to post warnings about an individual's behavior without identifying that person. I know the OP was just trying to warn others about a problem but it could have and should have been done differently. Reputations are important to professionals and they should not be impugned without proof. It was wrong one hundred years ago,it is wrong in today's digital world and it will be wrong one hundred years from now. I feel sorry for those who do not "get it".

Congratulations on owning The Holy Grail in shape of The Eternal Truth!

Sadly your pedagogical approach comes out short of convincing me. If you were so eternally right, a few arguments supporting your position wouldn’t be too hard to come up with. Neither would a few illustrative samples of your imagined “other ways”.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

http://www.dwerden.com/talk/forum/messa ... erthread=y" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

Are the phone numbers listed in this link still good? Maybe we should phone-spam this dirtbag?

sc_curtis wrote:http://www.dwerden.com/talk/forum/messa ... erthread=y" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

Are the phone numbers listed in this link still good? Maybe we should phone-spam this dirtbag?

That would be an illegal approach. But if something like that would happen, then it should be done by collect call (or what term applies).

K

I don't know how it works in the US, but if you have a phone number can't you get an address?

FWIW, my wife and I spent the day today with one of the nicest individuals in the business, a trombone player/dealer. He told us about Jared Riley as well, and I have no reason not to believe him. Approximately $16K worth of trombones stolen from him.
The thing that makes me VERY sad, is that we (low brass players) live in a very small community with relatively few outlets to choose from when buying a new horn, and one lone individual can change the buying/selling landscape for all of us. What a shame.
I hope that justice will be served. In any event, karma has a way of catching up with people.

jonesbrass wrote:FWIW, my wife and I spent the day today with one of the nicest individuals in the business, a trombone player/dealer. He told us about Jared Riley as well, and I have no reason not to believe him. Approximately $16K worth of trombones stolen from him.
The thing that makes me VERY sad, is that we (low brass players) live in a very small community with relatively few outlets to choose from when buying a new horn, and one lone individual can change the buying/selling landscape for all of us. What a shame.
I hope that justice will be served. In any event, karma has a way of catching up with people.

That is why the OP did the right thing. And why it sounds so extremely out of tune when somebody blows his Peckhorn.

By links made available by this thread it is possible to learn which action the US Army took towards the funny guy.

Dave Werden is a very diplomatic person. Try to read his questions to the seller of the stolen euph. On the surface glaced in sugar, but really going for the core of the problem.

Klaus

Wade and Klaus are right on this issue.

I work for a government agency that, among other things, enforces consumer protection laws. On our side, when we allege a violation, the allegation itself is a public document. However, for the sake of courtesy/innocent-until-proven-guilty/etc., we do not go out of our way to publicize things until after a hearing and a conclusion.

However, that doesn't apply to non-governmental outlets. For example, the BBB publishes the number of complaints they receive against a business. Lots of newspapers, websites, TV and radio news, and other media outlets publish accusations before they are proven.

I firmly believe that more information is better than less. If I'm considering doing business with someone for significant cash, I want to know if others have accused the guy of being a thief, even if it hasn't been proven in court. Ebay feedback is the same - somebody doesn't have to prove their case in court before they leave negative feedback.

Some positions articulated in this thread appear intended primarily to prevent alleged crooks' feelings from being hurt. Klaus' and Wade's position prevents honest people from losing their hard earned money.

Klaus and Wade are right.

the elephant wrote:This is no court of law, so we do not have to satisfy the burden of proof.

But, as Elephant was so good to stay on top of it to make sure he was right, we have to be damn sure the allegation is correct to avoid fallout the other way.

FWIW:
Not all crimes are prosecuted. Not all incidents such as this are crimes, although many are. This is about the 4th time I have seen posts about this fellow in the slightly less than two years I have been a member of this on-line community. As someone who was looking to buy a euphonium at the time one of these other posts was going on, I apreciated the warning that there had been some not-so-successful dealings with this person.

I notice the neither the individual mentioned, nor anyone else to whom he has "sold" a horn has chimed in on any of these threads to offer a counter argument. I have puchased one horn from a fellow on this site, one horn from an e-bay seller, and three mouthpieces from another fellow on this site. If I saw any negative posts about any of the three of them, I would answer up with my 100% positive experiences in purchasing, sight unseen and untested, a tuba and a euphonium, along with the mouthpieces.

It is one thing to "trash" someones reputation, even in this relativley anonymous environment, it is quite something else to alert our small community to a dishonest individual with a fairly lengthy track record.

Ally"who doesn't arrest people for 'allegedly' committing crimes, although that is how it is reported"House

Thank you to the OP for the information and warning. I would like to remind everyone that slander and libel are important issues on the internet. This thread contains in a round about way, a very lively discussion about these issues.

Here are some definitions:

Slander: Slander is an untruthful (oral) spoken statement that harms the person's standing in the community. Slander is a tort or civil wrong and the injured person can bring a lawsuit against the person who made the false statement.

Libel: Libel is an untruthful statement published in writing or through broadcast media, that injures a person's standing in the community. Again, due to the nature of the matter, it is a tort or civil worng and the injured party can bring a lawsuit against the person who made the false statement.

I wish our society was not overly litigious. As already discussed, this forum is NOT a courtroom and we do not want to see any of the innocent injured parties in a lawsuit. However, I realize this offender might not want to end up in court. LOL! My thanks again to the OP for his open discussion and I do hope our community can help those injured by this incoragible person recover their missing/stolen items. Caveat Emptor: Let the Buyer Beware. Caveat Venditor: Let the Seller Beware! Truly great words to live by.

Have a great weekend.

Paul Weikle

I'd like to state for the record that the original poster, Mr. Ord is one of the most honest and forthright individuals with whom I have served in my meager twenty-two years in the Army. I highly supported his assignment to the Army school of Music and worked with Department of the Army personnel managers to get him there as quickly as possible after his selection. The events under discussion seem abbreviated and opinionated in a forum such as this. Know that they took place over many months and there were many other senior Soldiers involved in the process (including that of the purchaser not maintaining employment with the Army)

The criminal activity in question is only in dispute by those who possess little or no knowledge of the events mentioned. Military leadership here and in the unit in which the sub-standard performer served worked together to try and resolve the issue between Jared and Dan, with little success. Promises were made and not kept. Period. All of the $&*! house lawyers and differing opinions based on individual circumstances will not change two things. That Jared acted inappropriately in his business dealings with Dan (whether any of you know the details or the months of patience and communication on Dan's part or not), and that Dan Ord would like this not to happen to any of the rest of us.

Thanks Dan - Having just bought a new horn, I will be sure to deal with reputable individuals and deal in kind with others! Mostly thanks for having the pieces to post this and help others knowing that you'd get tagged.

I truly hope that Jared learns from this and becomes a reputable member of the low brass community.

Jeff

snufflelufigus wrote:Remember kids, revenge is best served cold.

Revenge is a dish best served cold!
---General Chang