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Some single Bb horns, like mine, have the 4th/fourth/F valve as well as the stopping valve to be operated by the left thumb. Works well, only fast works becomes demanding.

Klaus

I remember seeing a picture of something like this a while ago on here.

Someone's creative workaround for making a 4-valve student horn was to take a front action 3-valve piston horn and add a 4th rotor. I can't remember much more than that, though I can clearly see that picture it in my mind!

bort wrote:I remember seeing a picture of something like this a while ago on here.

Someone's creative workaround for making a 4-valve student horn was to take a front action 3-valve piston horn and add a 4th rotor. I can't remember much more than that, though I can clearly see that picture it in my mind!

Art Hovey made his "Frugalhorn":

http://www.galvanizedjazz.com/tuba/frugalhorn.html" target="_blank

Not the prettiest thing in the world but it works.

The Big Ben wrote:Art Hovey made his "Frugalhorn":

http://www.galvanizedjazz.com/tuba/frugalhorn.html" target="_blank" target="_blank

Not the prettiest thing in the world but it works.

Art’s concept is truly of my liking. One of its virtues is, that it allows younger females with smaller hands to play the tuba.

Is the girl on the photo the same one, who laid out the foundation under the Morning-TV-large-jazz-band, which Art linked to this spring/summer?

Klaus (who has an idea on how to add a thumb activated valve to sousaphones without changing the instruments irreversibly)

One of my future projects is to add a 4th valve to a three valve King 1240 but I want to add the 4th valve with a rotary thumb valve. One of the problems with the King horns is a stuffy 4th valve register, so I thought by using a rotor farther down the bugle where the bore is larger, it might help that issue. I am thinking of tuning to it Eb rather than F to facilitate the lower register. If I configure the first valve slide up top to be able to be pulled I will be able to lower the sharp 1-3 and 1-2-3 valve combinations.

ken k

The Big Ben wrote:

bort wrote:I remember seeing a picture of something like this a while ago on here.

Someone's creative workaround for making a 4-valve student horn was to take a front action 3-valve piston horn and add a 4th rotor. I can't remember much more than that, though I can clearly see that picture it in my mind!

Art Hovey made his "Frugalhorn":

http://www.galvanizedjazz.com/tuba/frugalhorn.html" target="_blank" target="_blank

Not the prettiest thing in the world but it works.

That's it! Thanks!

Being a former long time Horn player, I've thought about how much easier it would be for technical passages in the low range with the 4th valve being on the thumb. Anything that requires speedy fingers and 4th valve on the pinky is a bitch if you have to use the 4th valve alternatively throughout the passage. It sounds like a great experiment to use on my Conn 11J. I personally think it would make life easier having the 4th valve on the thumb, but that is just me, the long time ex-horn player, talking.

NDSPTuba wrote:Being a former long time Horn player, I've thought about how much easier it would be for technical passages in the low range with the 4th valve being on the thumb. Anything that requires speedy fingers and 4th valve on the pinky is a bitch if you have to use the 4th valve alternatively throughout the passage. It sounds like a great experiment to use on my Conn 11J. I personally think it would make life easier having the 4th valve on the thumb, but that is just me, the long time ex-horn player, talking.

I, too, spent time in the world of Horn and might like having the 4th valve on a thumb trigger.

After seeing Art's project a few months ago, I've been thinking about adding a rotor to my 2340. I don't think I'd want to have it done. I think it would be pretty expensive. I can't see putting $1-1.5 K into a horn that isn't worth much more anyway. Unless it was done really well, it would reduce the value below what it is now. Better to sell and get a 4v horn than 'upgrade' this one.

This would have to be an "at home" project. For the tinkerer with more than one horn, this might be an entertaining way to spend the hours this winter. I think I'll let one of you guys give it a try and I might copy you.

Jeff "One BBb horn" Benedict

I used a rotary fourth valve for position with a flugelhorn, below



I found the typical 4-in-a-row pistons impossibly uncomfortable, so I shaped the 4th key right to go right under the pinkie. Works great!

I might actually like having a 4th valve on my thumb...

Playing my 4 valve Eb in the low register requires pretty much holding down the 4th valve for every note between B natural and E natural. I've always found it to be awkward and uncomfortable. I think I would prefer having the 4th valve on my thumb, it would be much less uncomfortable (for me).

Of course, I could always get a 5 valve Eb. Or, you know, a contrabass tuba of some sort....

-Tim Murphy, perfectly happy just playing his 983.

Many years ago, I had acquired an Amati 3 upright valve F tuba, to which I had a fourth rotary valve added, on the thumb.

The arrangement was odd, or so I thought, but it worked (the technician who did the addition, did not recommend adding a rotary valve for the pinky, and I agreed at that time).

Unfortunately, the horn was not really worthy of all the effort (but was the only F tuba I could afford at the time!).

Bob1062 wrote: Tim, what you could do on your 983-
The 4th valve is just a regular valve, correct? None of that comp stuff running through it?

The 4th valve is a compensating valve, on the 983.

I used to play an old B&H euphonium with the 4th valve behind the 1st branch. I found it very strenuous on my left wrist. I put a lighter spring in the 4th valve and made a sprung lever operated with the right thumb. It wasn't easy to do, it took a lot of experimenting but totally worth it in the end! This would work well on the 983. I know the idea here is to have a rotary 4th valve but this is the next best thing.

Another idea, you could get a nice 4 inline piston horn and add a rotor. Put the 4th valve circuit on the rotor and add a 5th valve circuit to what was the 4th valve. That way the 4th valve (rotor) can be operated by the right hand thumb and the 5th (piston) by the pinky. You get the 4th thumb rotor on a 5v horn. If you don't want to add the rotor right away you could always start with the previously mentioned lever attachment controlling the 4th inline piston and do the conversion later.