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"Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:40 am
by mbeastep
Having just finished a run of eight performances of "Chicago" in Calgary, I can recommend the experience to all who have not yet had the opportunity to play it. This show is one of the few that uses a separate bass player and tuba player, rather than having someone double. That's good for me, since I don't play bass. Much of the music is twenties-style jazz, with tuba on the the bass line, while the bass takes over on the more ballad-style music. Although both arts could be played by a doubler, there is PLENTY of playing in the tuba book. As a player who doesn't get much chance to play jazz, I can't tell you how much fun it was to sit in with a very good onstage pit band. The music is most rewarding, with terrific tunes and arrangements. I found that my new Besson 983 Eb seemed to suit the part, and it was a good chance to get more used to the horn.
I'm probably preaching to the converted, because it seems that a lot of good players have played this music. The signatures on my book dated only back to 1996, but included such luminaries as Ryan Schultz, David Mills, Don Strand, Willie Clark, Sal Fratia, Ed Goldstein, Deanna Swoboda, David Zerkel, Don Waldrop, and Ellis Wean. I humbly added my name to the list.
Michael Eastep
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:44 am
by GC
I think whether there are separate bass and tuba parts depends on the size of the ensemble. When I played it in a keyboard-bass-drums group 4 or 5 years ago, my book had bass and tuba parts together. I was asked to play because I double, but the stage setup ended up being so small that there was no place for my tuba. I had to do the entire thing on electric bass.
The tuba part looked like a lot of fun. I wish I had been able to play it, but the music director said to just play bass if I couldn't do both.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:51 am
by MikeMason
yeah,fun playing,but let's get down to business.one word- FISHNET
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:23 am
by Mojo workin'
I played the Baltimore run of this musical three times. You're right, it's a blast. And the extra pay for being on stage was nice, too.
one word- FISHNET
Yes, this was most distracting. Especially when Roxie lays down on the wall in front of the tuba.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:02 pm
by Toad Away
one word- FISHNET
Shweeet !!
Hey Mike --
Since I don't know the music, just wondering why
you chose not to use your CC.
Glad to hear your new Eb is doing well for you.
-- Tim
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:33 pm
by tubapete
I got to play this show about 5 or 6 years ago. I hope to get the opportunity to play it again sometime.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:16 pm
by DonShirer
When I saw it in NYC a few years ago, the tuba/bass player doubled. Maybe they didn't have room for another body in the staircase shaped orchestra riser.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:41 pm
by eupher61
The book is written for a double, but doublers who are competent enough on both are rare enough (bass fiddle is required, not electric) that they usually plan on hiring separate.
The road tours travel with a bass, painted black, because they want as much as possible in the 'pit' to be black. The pit being upstage, as mentioned.
And yes, FISHNET. ooooooooooooooo
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:16 pm
by WaltTrombone
Ron Raffio is doing it on Broadway. He says it's mostly a tuba book, but with just enough string bass doubling to severely limit his choice of subs. It may well be that they redid it for the touring show because of that.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 2:39 pm
by mbeastep
bloke wrote:Is Vinnie Fanuele (former Stan Kenton bass trombonist) serving as music director/conductor for the current touring company? He seems to be a perennial choice for this show, as I've worked with him more than once in Chicago stints.
The last time the show came through here, he was (albeit in a civil way, and justifiably so) critical of some of the musicians' lack of ability to perform error-free shows after the first couple of shows. I strived to concentrate and to dodge bullets. As I slipped away at the end of the last show, he caught up with me, shook my hand, and told me that he enjoyed my work. This is not typical behavior from a Broadway show conductor, and I really appreciated it.
One of the main "tricks" to this show is this: Most tunes in this show are "two beat", but there are *many* different specific ways (depending on the specific tune...or a section of a tune) to appropriately execute articulations, lengths, and decays. I'm not sure that young conservatory-trained musicians without much experience in "traditional jazz", "dixieland", "tin pan alley", "mickey bands", "ragtime", just generic "Broadway" styles, or other related genre have the experience to properly perform this deceptively easy book.
Yes, I found that it took longer than the single rehearsal to figure out some of these (often unmarked) style changes. Fortunately, the musical tastes of my parents meant that I had a lot of early exposure to Broadway and ragtime styles, plus I've played a fair amount of dixieland, so I didn't feel as uncomfortable as if I had been immersed in a bebop world, for instance. It helped a lot to be sitting beside Lee Appleman, an excellent drummer who tours with the show. Also, Don York, the music director, gave me some very useful suggestions about the feel that he wanted; mostly to be sure never to be late on downbeats.
As to the choice of instrument, a CC would certainly have been a good sound for the show. The E-flat had the advantage of being small and light in a quite confined space. Access to the onstage bandstand was by a rickety, narrow staircase, and there was really very little room in the box. With the music stands fixed in height, I found reading the bottom line of the music to be problematic at times. Musically speaking, the time-keeping role of the part was paramount and, since we were miked, it seemed easier to use a smaller instrument. I admit I changed a few octaves for my own convenience.
Oh yes, the women. They were all beautiful, and the costumes were hot. This might have been a factor in the occasional missed cue. I was also well positioned for Roxie's indecent suggestion to her lawyer.
To correct my earlier post, the signatures on my part went back only to 2006, not 1996. That's when the show began.
Altogether a fine experience.
Michael Eastep
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 4:42 pm
by Barney
bloke wrote:I can find out if you're really curious (because we're doing it here). I DO know that it is NOT Vinnie Fanuele, who has done it through many tours.
Vinnie is back in New York, and has been playing trombone (tenor and bass) on the revival of Bye Bye Birdie.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:32 am
by Steve Marcus
eupher61 wrote:The road tours travel with a bass, painted black, because they want as much as possible in the 'pit' to be black.
The primary reason that I haven't accepted doubling gigs is that I don't own a string bass or a bow (yes, if there were enough such calls that my schedule would permit, I could find a decent upright bass for minimal dollars).
The secondary reason is that I haven't played string bass since college, and it was, admittedly, not my primary instrument then.
Since the tour company provides its own black string bass, is the part too challenging to be woodshedded within a reasonably short amount of time by someone who's been away from the instrument for years? Are there
arco passages, or is it all
pizz? (I'm sure that the tour company doesn't provide a
bow.)
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:23 am
by Sean Greene
Steve Marcus wrote:eupher61 wrote:The road tours travel with a bass, painted black, because they want as much as possible in the 'pit' to be black.
The primary reason that I haven't accepted doubling gigs is that I don't own a string bass or a bow (yes, if there were enough such calls that my schedule would permit, I could find a decent upright bass for minimal dollars).
The secondary reason is that I haven't played string bass since college, and it was, admittedly, not my primary instrument then.
Since the tour company provides its own black string bass, is the part too challenging to be woodshedded within a reasonably short amount of time by someone who's been away from the instrument for years? Are there
arco passages, or is it all
pizz? (I'm sure that the tour company doesn't provide a
bow.)
There is some exposed arco stuff on "Class", if I remember correctly. I second Bloke's comment that this show requires a high level of concentration. For several reasons.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 12:05 pm
by sloan
Sean Greene wrote:Steve Marcus wrote:eupher61 wrote:The road tours travel with a bass, painted black, because they want as much as possible in the 'pit' to be black.
The primary reason that I haven't accepted doubling gigs is that I don't own a string bass or a bow (yes, if there were enough such calls that my schedule would permit, I could find a decent upright bass for minimal dollars).
The secondary reason is that I haven't played string bass since college, and it was, admittedly, not my primary instrument then.
Since the tour company provides its own black string bass, is the part too challenging to be woodshedded within a reasonably short amount of time by someone who's been away from the instrument for years? Are there
arco passages, or is it all
pizz? (I'm sure that the tour company doesn't provide a
bow.)
Stay between the lines...
There is some exposed arco stuff on "Class", if I remember correctly. I second Bloke's comment that this show requires a high level of concentration. For several reasons.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 7:37 pm
by sloan
bloke wrote:
- The helicon offers me far more panoramic vision of the stage than a concert tuba, as well as downward vision to the music (as those of you who've done a few runs of this show understand the music stand situation).
Why do I think it's the "panoramic vision of the stage" that's the real selling point here?
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:51 am
by imperialbari
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:57 am
by 2baGuy!
What other shows use a tuba in the pit?
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:52 pm
by JB
2baGuy! wrote:What other shows use a tuba in the pit?
South Pacific
The King and I
The Sound of Music
Annie
Barnum
The Boy Friend
Lion King
Phantom
Drood - The Mystery Of Edwin Drood
Hello Dolly
My Fair Lady
The Wizard of Oz (Royal Shakespeare Company 1988 version)
Crazy for You
Kiss Me Kate
Meet Me in St. Louis
The Will Rogers Follies
Cats (euphonium)
Little Women (euphonium)
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:17 pm
by windmill
A Year with Frog and Toad - Tuba/Upright bass
Chitty Bang Bang - Tuba/Upright bass (a result of orchestra reductions from the British version)
The World Goes Round - Tuba/Upright bass/electric bass.
I think Annie should be done with tuba/upright bass doubling. The original had both I believe. Songs in the score lean one way or the other IMHO. There is a revival planned for the Fall.
Music Man is another that sounds great with some march tunes done on tuba for a bassist who likes to stretch. Originally scored only for Bass.
Much of the doubling scoring in musicals in the last 10-15 years have been scored for Bass Trombone/Tuba. Chicago dates back to the 1970's when bass/tuba doublers were less of a dying breed.
Lion King, and I think Mary Poppins and also perhaps Ragtime are all trombone/tuba.
Steve.
Re: "Chicago," the musical
Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:30 pm
by Lee Stofer
This musical makes me very happy that I bothered to practice bass over the years, for no one else in this area does so, and they prefer to have a tuba/bass doubler to paying two people for this musical.
I first played this with a local theater company in Atlanta, so I had spent 4 weeks with the show in Georgia before moving to Iowa and getting called when the Broadway tour came to Davenport, Iowa. The show was in Davenport for just two nights, so we had one of the more intense 4-hour rehearsals I've ever witnessed (yes, with Vinnie F.), played the show that night, and played it again the next night. Cartage and doubler's fees are attractive, much more than covering the chiropractor's fees afterwards. I guess I made a mistake when I did the Broadway production. Although seeing a lot of TubeNetter's names written in the book, there was a clear note that said not to write anything in or on the book, so I didn't sign my name - oh,well.........
At the time, I had Bob Tucci's old York CC, which was an awesome horn for the gig, using the detachable front-bell. It was tight in the steep bandstand, and the switch from tuba-to-bass-to-tuba is sometimes a trick, but it is manageable. The book is mostly tuba, so anyone who has just basic competency on bass can handle those parts. As Bloke mentioned, one needs to listen to what is going on around him, style-wise, with really "Big Ears", as there is a lot of style in the musical which is not notated. I never saw the black string bass. I brought mine in for rehearsal, and we went with that. No one even mentioned it.
I encourage you guys who have an interest in doubling to "go for it", as I just finished doing two more weeks of, "Chicago" with a professional summer theater west of Chicago, IL. They were quite happy, and now I'm on their call list for bass and tuba.
