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For Christmas, I received a copy of the Young/Jacobs Arban Method for Tuba published by Encore. I also have an Old, old copy of Arban's Method for Cornet (It once belonged to Capt.Thomas Darcy). I notice that this old Arban is written a whole step lower, at concert pitch, than the new tuba book. This seemed strange to me, because that displaces the fingering for a BBb tuba to the next higher key.
However, I'll bet that the Young/Jacobs version is written for CC tuba. Hmm!

It is. As is most of the tuba stuff from Encore Music.

Tubas are concert pitch, non transposing instruments. They read the same music no matter what key the actual instrument is keyed in. Instead of re-writing the music for different keyed instruments, the fingerings are changed. I suppose you could say that the tuba uses "transposing fingerings" rather than 'transposed music". (Exceptions, of course, mainly being British BB music) The particular key of tuba is selected by the type of music being played. If the music is mainly "down in the basement", a contrabass tuba (BBb, CC) is chosen. If the music is mainly "up in the rafters", a bass tuba (Eb, F) is chosen. YMMV. However, the music on the page is the same no matter what key of tuba is being played.

'I'm guessing" (which could be dangerous) that the Arban Cornet book is actually written for a Bb instrument. So, when a Bb cornet player reads and plays C, it comes out as Bb in relation to the piano. When a tuba reads C and fingers a C in relation to the key of their instrument, a C comes out in relation to the piano. An Arban book written for the Bb cornet would reflect that difference.

Jacobs says that his version of Arban's is written so the keys 'lie better' for the CC tuba. I think that means, fingering pattern wise, it 'works' better on the CC tuba. I have a copy of the Young/Jacobs Arban's and play the BBb tuba so I don't notice that. In reality, it's just a plain ol' tuba book, written like the majority of tuba music- at concert pitch.

Seems to me that it was raised a step so that the fingerings for CC tuba would be the same as the trumpet book fingerings for BBb trumpet. It's the logical step for CC players.

If you really want to use Arban's for any key tuba and keep the fingerings the same, it's simpler to learn to read trumpet fingerings and use the trumpet book. It's the same principle that brass bands use.

GC wrote:Seems to me that it was raised a step so that the fingerings for CC tuba would be the same as the trumpet book fingerings for BBb trumpet. It's the logical step for CC players.

For years, guys used the 'bone book (written in concert pitch) but down an octave. When a CC tuba plays concert pitch music, it uses "Bb trumpet fingering" down an octave in bass clef. You want C in the staff, 'open'. You want 'Bb', mash down "1".

When a Bb trumpet uses transposed music, "C" is played 'open' but, to the piano, sounds like Bb.

I guess I'm not understanding something or someone.

It's because Bb trumpet is a transposing instrument and tuba is a concert pitch instrument. For example, the concert Bb scale for trumpet is written C D E F G A B C, but the sounds it gets are Bb C D Eb F G A Bb. The fingerings are 0, 1-3, 1-2, 1, 0, 1-2, 2, 0. With a CC tuba, that fingering pattern produces a concert C scale since bass clef tubas all play in concert pitch.

Because of that, the Arban/Jacobs book is actually has the same written notes as the trumpet book dropped two octaves, which produces pitches a step higher (though down two octaves) than the trumpet book. It's because the trumpet produces sounds a step lower than what's written, while C tuba produces concert pitch.

This allows the CC tuba book and the Bb trumpet book to use the same fingerings in the exercises, though the sound produced by playing the trumpet book is a whole step short of being two octaves above the pitches in the tuba book.

To further complicate things (of course), a BBb tuba playing from the BBb trumpet book (using trumpet fingerings) will sound the full two octaves below the BBb trumpet. A C trumpet and CC tuba both playing from the trumpet book will sound fully two octaves apart.

Thanks, all.
I do understand the differences in open-pipe pitches, transposed/C (bass clef) instruments, and fingering patterns that lay well . . . or not, as the case may be.
Many years ago I switched from violin to Eb tuba, and to this day I know the fingerings for TC Bb trumpet.
I have also used Arban for trombone, and, via the old cornet book, pieces of it for BBb tuba. I switched to BBb nearly 60 years ago.

[Trying to paste 1st page of Darcy's Arban . . .It was $3.50 in soft cover]

I also understand that new tuba players are usually introduced with band methods or other less comprehensive study books, and that Arban for tuba is a “pro” resource. That’s why I wanted it. . . and I was ecstatic when I opened the gift.
However, I was surprised by the key shift – - I realized what was up in the middle of my post to Tubenet. - BUT, I can play those keys, and I will use, enjoy, and profit by the book as is.
BUT, I will use the easy fingering for COV.

It is good that you are excited about using the Arban book. The important thing to remember is that it really doesn't matter which edition, clef, or keyed tuba you are using. What you need to accomplish from this book is complete fluency in all keys, on any keyed tuba you happen to chose to play, in any register of any tuba. The book is designed to get you fluent. Oh, make it musical also and you will have really accomplished much from your study of the Arban book. Let us know how it's going in about 30 years!!

Enjoy,

Richard Murrow

The Kopprasch from encore ROCKS! and that new Bordogni book is pretty dang nice too. The Arbans is ok no solos in the back I guess because most people dont play solos on their cc tuba.

The bulk of the Arban is quite approachable for almost all players of tubas in any key. As Wade points out, it simply requires reading the treble clef fingerings (as if someone were playing a trumpet), but most of the technique workout stuff is not that challenging from a fingering standpoint.

The characteristic studies, however, are another matter. I have taken the liberty of transposing all fourteen of these to the various tuba keys and into bass clef and the correct octave. These are incredibly valuable for both building technique and for breath control, as the phrases are incredibly long. If you haven't taken a look at the characteristic studies, do so sometime...they are worth the time to work on.

I'll second Elephant's observations regarding treble clef Arban studies. I'll go a step further and suggest there is a ton of good material we can steal from trumpet, horn, and even from woodwind pedagogy. One of my favorites from the latter group is Andraud's collection of oboe solos.

But maybe best of all for me personally has been Claude Gordon's stuff. Clear thinker, excellent communicator - his books have helped me cut through a lot of the mush that has occasionally taken up residence between my brain and ears, tongue and lungs.

Here is a link to get you started, if you are of a mind to.

http://www.claudegordonmusic.com/biography.htm" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

I started on trumpet in grade school. So when I want to play Arban, I just use the original and pretend I'm playing British brass band style transposed treble clef conventional notation.

Way too big a deal has been made out of this. Since tuba players play concert pitch, if they want the same fingerings as the original version for Bb cornet/trumpet in standard convention transposed treble clef notation (written treble clef middle C played open valves, etc.) (given the two octaves down) transpose everything down a full step for BBb, leave it the same for CC, transpose it up a minor 3rd for Eb and a perfect 4th for F.

Hey, that's neat. . . Just read to fingering. . . kind of like just playing of treble clef in a 3 flats lower key. (In fact, that puts the BBb tuba into a prettier range. Conversely, years ago, I played trombone from Eb sax music that way).
ANYHOW. . . This CC Arban book works fine as written. I'm not the musician's musician that can transpose on sight or can have the command of the my ear/horn connection that makes key moot, but I CAN work on on playing what's written on the horn in my hand. That works for my new book.
BTW, are Encore's versions of Bordogni, etc. transposed for CC tuba? . . . Or, maybe were the originals (and I just never thought about it?)?
Playing for myself is no problem. Boosting ensembles is a tubists' mission. There's always a way to get it into the right key.