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Greentubaguy wrote:I have heard that as a Tuba player, one is expected to be able to play a total range of at least 4 octaves, from the Bb that is two octaves below the bass clef, all the way to the Bb that lies 2 octaves above the bass clef. Is this true for all players, or just professionals from Wind Symphonies or Philarmonics? Thanks for the information!

Yes, it's true. In fact, you get just one chance, in grade school band: they hand you a tuba, and see if you can cover 4 octaves. Fail at this, and you have to play trombone.

Was there a more specific situation that you had a question about? Tuba players, in general, is a pretty broad category, and "one is expected" is a pretty vague way to establish a criterion.

I am going out on a limb, here but, the 4 octave information is just a possibility, not fact. Personal experience (when I was at my best) is that a BBb can play chromatically (note that), from C# , almost two octaves down from the bottom line Bb, to the Bb one octave above the top Bb on the bass clef staff. Virtuosi may be able to pull the 4 octaves (5 valves needed) chromatically; but we mere mortals are somewhat limited. The range of all keys of tuba (BBb, CC, EEb, F, etc) covers a very wide area, to be sure. This is just my opinion; take it for what it's worth.

I have known multiple high school students who possess such a range. They can hit the notes, perhaps even consistently. The trick is actually being able to play and make music in those registers. Otherwise, the ability to squeak out/fart out those notes is little more than (as I think bloke called it) a parlor trick. But to answer your question, yes, those notes can all be played on a BBb tuba, and are not strictly the province of virtuosi.

the elephant wrote:My Mirafone 184 is a bit difficult to play some of the very high, light and soft material (very soft high F sharps and such), but that is the tone they want. They do not like the F tuba sound as much. However, it is actually a lot easier to play this piece on my Holton BAT. And I can play it soft enough, too; no problem. Wade

I found the same thing with my 184 and the VMI 3301. I thought it was just me. Care to expand on why you think this happens? I don't know enough to form a logical opinion but I do know what I hear and would like your opinion.

Range on BBb tuba mainly depends on its size.

Average players:

3/4 BBb: 25-30'

4/4 BBb: 20-25'

5/4 BBb: 15-20'

6/5 BBb: 10-15'

the elephant wrote:and appreciated even less in the end.

Just so you'll know, I appreciate you.

the elephant wrote: the extremes of both instruments have a way of informing our playing when on the so-called *correct* horn.

My experience (as an amateur) is different than yours (as a professional). Nevertheless, I disagree strongly with this one point .

In my opinion and experience, it is the notes on the "correct" horn that "inform our playing" when on the other horn.

Remember, for the average player, it is success that leads to more success. Playing moderately high (for me) on an Eb helps me (in your excellent term: "informs my playing") when I switch to a BBb and play the same notes (which are now HIGH...for me). Going the other way does not help (me) - instead, I find myself taking the "tricks" I need to play very HIGH (for me) on the BBb and using the same tricks when playing a note that is more secure on the Eb (and which I can play more easily, with better tone, without the "tricks"). If I play these notes often on the Eb, I find that you are correct - the notes are there on the BBb WITHOUT THE TRICKS.

Now, for a professional trying to get that last note or three at the very, very high end, it might well be that playing high on a contrabass may make you more aware of what the problems are, and remind you to play with more attention to detail - which "informs your playing" when you switch to "the correct horn".

It just doesn't work that way (or, at least not efficiently) for me.

As regards the post by the Elephant; I stand corrected. Thank you.

bloke wrote:1/ BBb tubas are "normally" played in bands.

2/ Band music for tubas is "normally" written between the pitches E (4 ledger lines below the staff) and G (4th space in the staff).

bloke "What do I win?"

That's about right. I've seen the odd low D, and LOTS of low Eb's (well, sometimes they aren't actually WRITTEN....but conductors get this little smile on their face when we make the choice correctly.) and occasionally run into some idiot transcriber who thinks bandies can play up to the D above middle C. (why do they think we have those euphs sitting next to us? Do they think we are String Basses?) If I've seen anything higher or lower in the last 11 years (outside an exercise book) I probably did the right thing and ignored it.

what do you win? The opportunity to fine tune one of those Holtons in your shop so that it plays from D to D (and every note in between) perfectly. lower and higher can do anything you want...I don't care. 3 octaves (4 Ds) from D to shining D, is adequate.

F.O.B. Birmingham.

[cut them to C and I'll see that someone cuts YOU]

bloke wrote:1/ BBb tubas are "normally" played in bands.

2/ Band music for tubas is "normally" written between the pitches E (4 ledger lines below the staff) and G (4th space in the staff).

bloke "What do I win?"

Bb tuba music written for British-style brass bands regularly goes down into the D - Bb zone.

My experience is that the lowest playing required is on 'BBb bass' in brass bands. I regularly go down to A, or G (two octave below staff concert pitch), but rarely lower than Eb (one octave below) in concert band. For high register, I really do not know as BBb is not a tool I choose to use in the high register, as I tend to consider BBb a contrabass, or low register tuba. I would have thought a range to BBb on top of staff sufficient for most band players - maybe the D above for more advanced players.

Unlike the Elephant I certainly find the high register more secure on bass tuba. In fact even between Eb and F tubas I find a distinct difference. For music venturing higher than Eb above the staff, I will tend to reach for the F now I have one. Not to say I cannot play in the very high register on lower pitch tubas (I have up to G on CC tuba in concert), but unless I specifically want a broader tone, it will (as a rule) just be easier and safer (slot and pitch more secure) on the higher pitch tuba.

But having said all that, I do think being able to play higher passages using different tubas very useful as a practice aid. There has been a few times when I have been struggling to pitch correctly on the CC (usually involving A, or Ab at top of staff) - have played the passage a few times correct on Eb and solved the problem. Conversely, when rehearsing the Gregson Concerto last year, there was one passage I was having particular problems on the Eb, but found I could play without difficulty on the CC. After two weeks practising on CC, when I tried again on Eb, I miraculously had no further problems. I guess I had just learnt to play it right!

.

the elephant wrote:And I played a BBb 186 the San Antonio Youth Orchestra for a while as well as in the TMEA region orchestra and had to knock out the Hungarian March on it with one and a half day's rehearsal. That requires a pretty solid high E. So my experiences must not have been normal. (Bear in mind that your favorite pachyderm never made the TMEA All-State Band… )

(And I still have a recording of that performance of the Hungarian March on a BBb 186, too. It is on a very hissy old cassette tape.)

When I was a senior in high school, we played the popular band arrangement of Carmina Burana at contest. That has a high D and a high E in it. I played that on a Miraphone 186 (that I did not own, and had the use of for only one semester) and was able to play it.

I just wish I could play it now.

And all my solo contest music went up above the staff, one piece going has high as D. I played nearly all those solos on a plastic sousaphone.

In Houston, we usually didn't compete in UIL contests, and few of us ever attempted to try out for region band. I didn't, though I did play in All-City Band, which was a creation of the Houston school district. Of course, HISD at the time had 40 or 50 high schools, all of which were AAAA (the largest class at the time). The suburban districts always tried to stack the deck against the big-city districts (what were they afraid of, fer cryin' out loud?), and Houston was one that just went its own way in those days.

Rick "who uses F tuba for that sort of thing now, and enjoys it a lot more" Denney

OK, time for the fun to start....

It depends on the size of the tuba... a 6/4 I'd guesstimate 15 yards... a YBB 103 maybe 25 yards...

actually my mind went a different way.
I thought it depended on the amount of black powder you used and whether you used shot or solid balls.

bubbacox wrote:To "Greentubaguy":
Just curious, that's all.

I, on the other foot, am not curious because I know that it is because he has chlorophyll.

athlete's foot???

Greentubaguy wrote:My name derives from the fact that I''m obsessed with wanting to see a tuba whose color is not silver plated or lacquered.

Just a few examples...