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I believe the topic is self explanatory.

I have 3, a Besson Compensating 3 valve, a Mirafone 1270 3 valve, and a Conn 21J. That being said, I would use them all more often if: A) They had 4 valves B) they were front action (This one I'm working on). I have a feeling that regardless of what bell I have on it I will use the Conn a great deal more when it is front action, just because I prefer it and feel more comfortable while playing a front-action tuba.

I never cared much for marching tubas or contras, but I think sousaphone hate is anti-American.

KiltieTuba wrote:I wish I had a recording bell, I could be so much louder for all my outdoor community band stuff - they don't like the marching tubas or sousaphones I bring - even though I make it sound good.

That's the only reason that I'm trying to find another recording bell for my Conn, so when I send one out to be converted into an upright bell I can still have a recording bell for my American Legion Band gigs over the summer. The last gig my 21J played (as a 21J) was an outdoor gig under a "circus style" tent at a cemetery, I know if I had my 188 I would have had a very hard time being heard over the group. A recording bell can be seen as a "bad" thing but they sure can come in handy!

I have a 20J that I use for all of my outdoor gigs. That thing has SOUND!

I have a 1937 King Recording Bell tuba. It is a BBb and three valved. The horn was purchased in 1976 and I have played it continuously to this day. I love the warm round sound and the ease with which it plays. I had it replated in nickel when I bought it(for the sum of $250.00) and the finish has lasted. It has acquired a few small dents which will be fixed this week and a broken valve guide on my third valve. Otherwise it is in fine shape.
By contrast I purchased a VMI four valve horn last spring and I am having my first experience with a rotary valve tuba. Compared to the King it is fussy, tempermental and difficult to get used to.

I have the recording bell for my York Master, but I never use it.

When I need that sort of outdoor directionality, the 14K sousaphone is easier to get to and looks the part.

Most of the time, though, I just use my regular instruments for outdoors.

Rick "who used to own a 20J" Denney

My Marzan is a detachable bell, the upright bell is soldered on and the recording bell has been unused for 30+ years.

This past summer, I bought a MW-37 without the bell from Lee Stofer. After I received it, I took it up to Sam Gnagey and he put an old King recording bell on it. The bell was a great match for the rest of the horn....looks like it was made that way. It's great to have a 5 valve CC bellfront for outdoor concerts (especially when there's only 2 tubas in a 60-70 pc. community band.) It really cranks out the sound, and I got lots of compliments on it. Thanks Lee & Sam!

I have both upright and recording bells for my old BBb Martin with the Nirschl valve set. I usually use the upright Buescher bell, but I put the original Martin recording bell back on for summer band concerts and it draws a lot of compliments.
One of my students is using a King with a recording bell, and sounds great on it.
When I was in high school everyone used recording bells; my father considered upright bells old-fashioned.
Tubas with recording bells last a lot longer in schools because kids can't stand them up on the bell.

With the help of Dan Schultz, I finally got a tenon and got my recording bell up and running. Where I got it from took the tenon off the recording bell and put it on an replacement upright bell, which has served me well and sounds great. But I do have a few gigs during the year that are either outdoors, but so small that I don't want to take the souzy, or are indoors without a sound shell, so I need the projection. So I have both bells up and running on my 186.

The only kicker is that the upright bell is shorter, so I have to have a long tuning slide for the upright bell and a stock length main tuning slide with the recording bell.

Intonation differences: with the recording bell, all the octave and 5ths are right on, and the 5th partials are a tad flat in traditional Miraphone fashion. But with this particular upright bell, the octaves are slightly compressed, meaning the high range can be flat if not focused, and the lowest range can be sharp, again, if not focused. But the 5th partials are different: D needs 1+2, but is not sharp with that combo, Db 2 is only a few cents flat and lippable, and C 1 is right on.

I have a Conn 20J with *both* forward and upright bells. I got the body and forward bell on a trade for my King 1240. The one outdoor concert I do each year is done, so I am going to sell the whole thing off and go back to a rotary horn. Look for an ad soon, or PM your interest in either the 20J horn or upright 2XJ bell.

Eric

Yes. A very nice BBb King 4v horn from the 60s.

I have a rotary valve King and a piston valve King each having both bells. A bell front, in the right hands, is pretty great. The sound is pure like with a micraphone because it doesn't have to reflect off of anything to get out front, and it doesn't sound behind for the same reasons. But it's a different approach to playing and if you are too aggressive with it the conductor and audience become pins to your bowling ball. Arnold Jacobs had a Holton with both bells, the bell front was for Ravinia where he felt like he wanted more sound.I don't use mine very often, conductors are skittish from previous experience, but since the trumpets ans trombones point forward why not the tuba? Another curmudgeon heard from. Ed

I have recording bells for my Martin BBb although I usually use an upright bell. I use the recording bell if a) I am playing in a band outdoors where there is no shell or "back wall" of any kind or b) I am playing in one of those "tin can" portable trailer/stage/shells. I agree that you have to play bell-fronts differently. The sound is more direct and so less rhythmic anticipation is necessary. Loud is less of a problem while playing quietly takes a bit more concentration, especially in the midrange.

I have both a standard 24 inch recording bell and a 30 inch behemoth that I'll trot out on very rare occasions!

tubatom91 wrote:I would use them all more often if: A) They had 4 valves

The very first tuba that I owned was a 24J/25J 4-valve Conn BBb (originally with a forward bell that I was actually able to exchange even-up for an upright bell so that it would look and sound more "legit"--try doing that now!). David Fedderly used to kid me and call the horn with the 24" upright bell a "trash can" because it did, admittedly, have the profile resembling his label. But it played well enough for me to study tuba, taking lessons from a very respected instructor and performing in tuba workshops. Younger players occasionally asked me, "Is that a 6/4 tuba?" I regretted having to sell it in order to afford my Nirschl CC (which I love and with which I will never part).

However, I now own a Conn 20J which I use with one of my Dixieland bands (the leader of one of the other Dixieland bands with which I play regularly insists upon a sousaphone, possibly for visual purposes--he probably wishes that I had a Jumbo sousaphone with a 32" bell for the same reason). The privileged tones on this 3-valve 20J play more clearly than the same pitches on the 4-valve 24J/25J and with good intonation. The 20J puts out a big, round sound with minimal effort. It facilitates emulating the sound of a string bass which is a welcomed trait in a Dixieland band. While one could "overdrive" it, it would have to be quite intentional. This beast behaves quite well.

B) they were front action (This one I'm working on).

Agreed. A front-action Conn (22J or 26J/36J?) would be much more comfortable.

I have only one horror story about playing a forward-bell tuba. It was when I was just "putting my toe in the water" with a British-type brass band in 1994, several years before I owned my Nirschl and co-founded the Chicago Brass Band. I was subbing for one of the BBb Bass players in Illinois Brass Band, which had already won one of its 6 NABBA championships in the 1990's (much like the Chicago Bulls--two "three-peats"). Michael Mulcahy, trombonist of the CSO with considerable brass band experience himself, was guest conducting and tuning the band just prior to our concert. He listened to each player individually while the band gathered backstage. When he got around to me, he glowered at the bell-front Conn, paused for a moment, and then asked the next player for a pitch, skipping me and my out-of-place forward-bell Conn entirely. I was so embarrassed and belittled that I wanted to take the bell off and put it over my head so that my face would hide from the world.

It wasn’t you to be embarrassed by that less than professional behavior, Steve.

Klaus

imperialbari wrote:It wasn’t you to be embarrassed by that less than professional behavior, Steve. Klaus

I wasn't faulting Michael Mulcahy. I was just emphasizing my embarrassment that such an accomplished musician as he, for whom one would want to make as positive an impression as possible, was dismissive about the horn being inappropriate for a British-type brass band.

Granted, one should bring the right tools for the right job. I just didn't own any other tuba at the time.

I have a large 4/4 1926 York 4 valve fixed recording bell tuba. Its for sale too!

Steve Marcus wrote:

imperialbari wrote:It wasn’t you to be embarrassed by that less than professional behavior, Steve. Klaus

I wasn't faulting Michael Mulcahy. I was just emphasizing my embarrassment that such an accomplished musician as he, for whom one would want to make as positive an impression as possible, was dismissive about the horn being inappropriate for a British-type brass band.

Granted, one should bring the right tools for the right job. I just didn't own any other tuba at the time.

Steve, I know you well enough to be sure that you had set the tuning slide right after the first note. If you could play the parts, then it what is was about.

I have a Besson New Standard BBb. It is good for certain low ranges and it is not at all a bad tuba. But my 40K has a projection in a class of its own. And my York Master BBb bell front allows for a smooth and buttery bass line.

I took the latter to a local brass band. Those snobbing for everything British and listening to British records rather than think for themselves frowned. After the first rehearsal, where I was the lone tuba, the repieno player reversed the little boy and the emperor and exclaimed: Now we have an in tune BBb.

Klaus