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Does anyone have experience with both? I play a B&H and was curious about the Yamaha?
Thanks.

HI-
Try the M&M aka Schiller aka Jin Bao 'Fletcher' copy Eb compensating 3+1 tuba--I think it is better than either of the two mentioned. Michael/M&M should have this horn at ITEC.
Regards-
mark

I investigated the Yamaha Eb tuba a couple of years ago. There are virtually none in the US for sale, it's more rare than the YamaYork. They are not commonly used in brass bands in the western hemisphere. The one German I talked to who had played it (a name you would/should know) said it played stiffly. I understood, at the time, that the YEB 631 had been replaced by the YEB 632.

It is comparable in size with the Besson 981/2.

Umm

The question was about BBb tubas, not EEb.

The four plus one compensating EEb is widely used by serious professional players - the BBb equivalent is not. Opinions on EEb tubas may not be relevant to BBb tubas here.

I have an old Boosey&Hawkes Imperial three valve BBb with the compensating third valve. I've never played the 631 or a four valve British BBb except for about five minutes so I can't offer feedback from hands on experience.

If you're investigating Sovereign clones you need to check out the VMI, York and Miraphone and current Besson as well as the Yamaha.

I think these clones would be based more on the later Sovereign with it's larger bell rather than the older, smaller, Imperial model.

Based on experience with a lot of Yamaha instruments (tuba, clarinet, saxophones, bass guitar etc.), I imagine the 631 would be easy to play with a nice sparkling colourful sound from little effort that may not stand up when you put serious air through it. That probably applies more to Yamaha's student lines; the 631 is a professional model and may be better than that.

As an aside I am not that keen on four plus one compensating BBb's. They are mainly used in the brass band world who use them because "that's the way it's always been done around here".
To me they feel and sound like they have a rag stuck down the bell compared to a decent German BBb. I'm not aware of anyone using one in an orchestra - I don't think they are capable of making any sound except a dull woofy sound that some like in a brass band tuba section.

If you are thinking of getting a new BBb check out what else is around - there's plenty, nearly all with more colour in the sound.

Regards

Gerard (who's just spent all day playing three Anzac day marches on the aforementioned Imperial BBb and can't wait to get back to his Miraphone 1291).

Re: the Yamaha 631 EEb - I'm talking EEb now - there are a number of EEb brass band players in Melbourne who have this model who like them very much.

N.B. these guys pretty much only play in brass bands and would have only ever played the Besson Sovereign EEb before getting their Yamaha's. (i.e. never played CC, BBb, F, anything with rotaries etc.)

Also N.B. - you CANNOT try several tubas and grab the pick of the bunch anywhere in Australia - you pay your money and wait - and take whatever they send you. These guys would have no way of knowing whether their previous Sovereign was a good or bad example, or their Yamahas for that matter although I suspect the Yamahas would be more consistent than the various incantations of the Besson.

While we're comparing the BBb Sovereign (I'm back on the BBb now) with it's clones this might be interesting.

http://www.4barsrest.com/reviews/products/inst010.asp" target="_blank

This review refers to an older model Miraphone but I think the comments on the general characteristics would still apply.

The Yamaha 631 is not a "different" tuba to an Imperial or a Sovereign - it's a slight variation on the same idea. There are other tubas around which are VERY different.

Regards

Gerard

four plus one compensating

Huh?

Alright, I made a mistake - beat me, I'm trash (I'm too used to five valves - marching has affected my brain), I meant THREE plus one. (I think it's three, I'll double check that).

Regards

etc. etc.

Bob Kolada wrote:

four plus one compensating

Huh?

Give the man a cigar. Yep, that really should read 3+1.

My first contact with the BBb 3+1 (Besson) was at Interlochen in 63. They were upright as opposed to the 3valve recording model my HS had purchased. Preferred the 4. By the next summer I had my 3 vale King which pretty well everybody preferred to the Bessons. (Incidentally, 64 saw Rex Conner with a new Melton instead of his old Beuscher.) Around that time Bessons were quite popular and U of Ill, for one had their tuba sections equipped with them.

The B&H 3 valve Imperials the army here had were bears on the march and not especially great sounding and I could get as much or more out of the Eb which was a bit friendlier for marching. I once got to compare Boosey and Yamaha BBb at national championships in Brisbane about 8-10 years ago and preferred the jap job. There were several others on display and one of the nicer horns was a Courtois Eb which Steve Rose had. The nationals would be one of the very few times one could compare different makes and models here. Having recently played on a Besson 992 for a few weeks I was not overly impressed.

I'm hoping to talk a local store owner into importing a few tubas such as Kanstul and Nirschel and maybe the Fletcher clones.

An interesting thing at those nationals was that quite a few people were using CC and F instead of only the old standard B&H BBb and Eb. For some time they were virtually banned from comps. When I played with Willoughby in 71-72 with my 4v King it caused a bit of a stir. The judge liked the different tuba sound and it was a fair part of why the band was upgraded from B to A grade. The King also got a lot of attention when I used it for concert work with the Army in the late 70s.

Hmmmmmm, maybe I should have gone to China a few years ago when asked to help develop some new tubas, Maybe a lot of you would be playing King Monster BBb clones now.

Hi Ken

All that pretty much mirrors my experience with these instruments.
I'm waiting for someone to flame me for my feelings on brass band tuba sound; these feelings come from many years of frustration, both playing and listening.

Regards

Gerard

Hey, if you don't like the brass band tuba concept - you should have been around when Boosey Eb was THE orchestra instrument. Ole Cliffy really hated my big King!!!!!!!!
Speaking of "Kings", there was Ian King in Melbourne who had what may have predated Fletch with the large bell on his. Very nice player - for a eupho on steroids. Great solo axe but somehow just didn't give the orchestras a real foundation.