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Hello.
I am a senior in high school, and am looking into college for music. however, I am unable to decide if i want to do performance or education. I realize that there are very very few jobs in performance, but i kinda feel like i just want to perform right now. I don't really know what to do, any advice is welcomed.

I try to avoid commenting on these, but I'm in a nostalgic mood.

I remember the same debate my senior year of high school You don't have to have a degree in performance to perform. We can argue til we're blue in the face about education degrees, but quite simply, if you want to teach, you'll need an education degree (there is the private school route, though, but that's another story). Ultimately, it is your life. I know plenty of people who are music education majors that are tremendous performers as well, there's no reason you can't perform whilst you get your education degree. You just have to follow your heart and do what you think is best for you, not what we tell you what you think you should do. Good luck with the audition process regardless of the degree track you decide on!

tubamage17 wrote:Hello.
I am a senior in high school, and am looking into college for music. however, I am unable to decide if i want to do performance or education. I realize that there are very very few jobs in performance, but i kinda feel like i just want to perform right now. I don't really know what to do, any advice is welcomed.

There is a pleathura of information in the archives about this. But here's my few cents...

- You don't NEED an education degree to be a great performer - you need to work hard, practice, and take advantage of any opportunities which will make you better. There are many "Ed" majors (or double majors) who are EXCELLENT performers.

- You DO need an education degree to be a certified teacher

- You do NOT need an Ed degree to be a professor, but having teaching experience will be VERY helpful

- You WILL teach in some manner, regardless of being an Ed major or not

When people wonder this, I always tell him/her to get the Ed degree or double major and work diligently to become proficient and excellent on the instrument. I am NOT suggesting using the Ed degree as a "fallback". The last thing anyone wants is "washed up performers" becoming educators in the schools (you should WANT to be a school teacher). I'm merely pointing out that you WILL be teaching to some extent.

If after your undergrad, you decide you want to continue to grad school, then there is nothing stopping you and you will be better off as a musician having been trained to teach. Teaching is one way to reinforce the best qualities of your own playing.

Just my thought.

i get what you guys are saying. i definitely (as of now) do not have any plans of teaching high school, and i guess i just want to play now. lol.

tubamage17 wrote:Hello.
I am a senior in high school, and am looking into college for music. however, I am unable to decide if i want to do performance or education. I realize that there are very very few jobs in performance, but i kinda feel like i just want to perform right now. I don't really know what to do, any advice is welcomed.

Do you take lessons, do honors band, all that stuff???

pierso20 wrote: - You DO need an education degree to be a certified teacher

No.

There is alternative teacher licensing in all 50 states.

There is no need for you or anyone else to major in performance. Take it from me, I have 2 performance degrees and 1 performance diploma all from highly respected musical institutions. If you see yourself possibly as a band director in public school, major in music education. If you want to perform, minor in music and practice your a** off, get a degree in something marketable. Those performance degrees hanging on the wall can become proverbial albatrosses hanging from your neck after several years. Woe unto you, the guy/gal who thinks he/she can make it as a player, yet does not know EXACTLY what it takes to do so. Good luck in your decision.

djwesp wrote:

pierso20 wrote: - You DO need an education degree to be a certified teacher

No.

There is alternative teacher licensing in all 50 states.

Regardless, you will still NEED appropriate certification. You WILL have to take classes of some sort and achieve the certification.

Perhaps my statement should have read as such, "You Do need an education degree to be a certified teacher, unless you want to graduate and then take more coursework to meet NCLB requirements to become a teacher".

There are other certifications and provisional certification that can be had, but GENERALLY speaking, it will still require a decent amount of coursework and, likely, some sort of student teaching (depending on different states, etc.)

I strongly agree with Mojo Workin' and Brooke. Especially, with the part of not using a Music Ed. degree to "fallback" on. That would simply be the worst decision of your life. Also, make sure to listen to Mr.Mojo. He's been through it...he knows what he's talking about.

You need to take a HUGE step back, and think about what YOU want to do. Not to sound like a dick, but you need to make a HUGE REALITY CHECK. How are you going to make a living? Unfortunately, the percentage of open paying tuba positions is slim to none. AND, as was mentioned, you still have to teach at some level. I am taking the Ed. route because that's what I LOVE to do.

Usually, I'm not this blunt, but the way you're asking (and answering) [ie. I just want to play...lol] seems kind of immature.

Joseph "IMO YMMV"

To be a college professor do you need to be a "certified teacher", or is that only refered to high school teachers?

tubaman1019 wrote:To be a college professor do you need to be a "certified teacher", or is that only refered to high school teachers?

I think it only really applies to public school educators. BUT, I've experienced some professors that could have really used an ed. class or two. Just an opinion...

Earning an education degree is no promise of a job. Nor even of a job interview, in heavily saturated areas.

MartyNeilan wrote:Earning an education degree is no promise of a job. Nor even of a job interview, in heavily saturated areas.

I have to admit, I am VERY fortunate to live in state with a decent supply of job openings. It upsets me that other states (well, including mine) do not value music as much as they value math and science. This doesn't mean that I don't think math and science are important, I just think music is an essential part of our lives.

Joseph

My usual advice on college majors. [long time readers can be excused at this point]

DO NOT base your choice of major on what JOB you think you will want 4 years from now (or 6 years from now, or 11 years from now). Unless, of course, you are sure that you want to be a teacher, or an engineer, or some other job that requires professional training instead of a college education.

DO consider college as the opportunity to "find yourself", or "explore", or any of the many other phrases that scare the dickens out of many parents. Screw the parents - they don't understand. It's their job to pay the bills and support you - as much as they can. It's not their job to run your life. It's not your job to live their lives through you. They had their chance. Chances are, they blew it. Listen to them. Respect them. Then take charge of your own life.

The way to a successful career in life is incredibly simple:

Step 1) find out what you want to do, 24/7
[HINT: you may have to try a lot of things before you find THE ONE. Kind of like women...]

Step 2) put in 10,000 hours doing that
[HINT: take a moment to compute how long that is, really]

Step 3) when you are really, really good at it, someone will pay you to do it

But, that's "strategy" - there are, of course, numerous "tactical" situations along the way. Little things such as "how will I eat this week". See "Parents, Duties and Responsibilities", above. Also see "Things I had to endure to reach my goal".

Most (repeat, MOST) students change their "major" during their undergraduate days. Many change their major several times. Some manage to complete several "majors" - others spend far too many years before finally squeaking out with one major completed. If you are 18 and in high school, it is best to assume that you have NO IDEA what kind of job you will want, and NO CLUE what you will eventually "major" in. Even worse - the numbers say that the major you choose now is very likely to be NOT the major you finish. So, tell me again why it matters if you get this choice right the first time?

Do your research, consider the choices, and pick one. You can always pick another one, next semester. In fact, I recommend it! Whatever you do, don't start working on a major because you think it's required for some job, or because Dad thinks it's a good major, because it's required for a high paying job.

Pick one that appeals to you, and find out if you like doing whatever it is they tell you to do, 24/7.

Do you like to play your horn 24/7, practicing and performing? Perhaps you can attend the University of Life. Move to Vegas, get a gig, and have a nice life. You don't need a college education. (hint: most people now in college don't *need* a college education).

In my opinion, music ED majors should be primarily attracted by the idea of teaching - and only secondarily concerned with performing for pay. But, you know, you can major in the Philosophy of Basket Weaving and still manage to pick up a teaching certificate...later. From the outside, it looks to me as if teacher training (and engineer training, and nursing training, and hotel management training...) just get in the way. But - if you *like* teacher training enough to do it 24/7, then that's what you should do. Maybe there's a career for you in teacher training (but perhaps not actual teaching).

You should NEVER major in something that you consider to be your "day job". Happy people don't have "day jobs". Happy people have lives. It's OK to have a "day job" - only please, don't waste you one shot at a college education by treating it as a day job. If college is your day job, quit! You can EARN more flipping burgers than you can attending college. Flipping burgers is a better "day job".

Consider: there are majors (and jobs) that you have not heard of. That, perhaps, have not yet been invented. Should you train to be a propeller designer on the eve of the jet age? You might as well major in MS-DOS maintenance. Or harpsichord performance.

Take 4 courses in your first semester from 4 different "majors". Pay attention to which one you spend the most time on. If the answer is "party" - then no one can help you. If the answer is "spend all my time in the practice room" then Go To "goto Vegas and get a gig". If you find yourself doing the minimum required in 3 courses and doing all the extra-credit work (and more) in the 4th - then you have found your "major".
Major in *that*. At least until you find something better. To that end, be certain to take at least 1 (preferably 2) courses every semester in something outside your major. One of *those* courses might even be "practical tuba performance", or "concepts in early elementary education lesson planning". But try to also cover some minimum competence in Science, Math, Writing, History, Philosophy, Language, and the like. Perhaps even a few courses in Computation,or maybe just IT - the edge always goes to the tuba player with computer skills.

Get a BROAD undergraduate education. Major in *something* (but it doesn't really matter what). Along the way, discover your passion - find out what you would pay to be allowed to do 24/7. Then, start accumulating the 10,000 hours it will take to become World Class in that skill/activity/scholarly pursuit. And wait for someone to offer you money to do it.

You may also have to get "a job" to support yourself. Well, times are hard, and you have to eat. Don't confuse that with the search for your passion. Manual labor is respectable. Technical jobs that leverage skills you have picked up along the way (piano, computer programming, teaching, historical analysis of the categorical imperative) are always good as "jobs" even if they are not your passion.

Only, please - do not miss out on the opportunity to DISCOVER your passion by zeroing in on training for a job that you can do, but which you will absolutely hate, 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, waiting for the weekend.

We now return you to regular programming. What mouthpiece do you favor?

What he said

Eh, I'm one of those lame people that chose a major corresponding to the career that I want. I'm such a loser...

Joseph

Sloan: Very well put, sir. I agree absolutely.

I just started my undergrad this semester. I am now majoring in tuba performance. For over a year before I started, I read and was told "the odds" relating to tuba jobs and the marketable "value" of a Music Performance degree. I know that. I know it sucks and that I can play the tuba just as well and eventually better with any other degree. I put my decision in a different light. With plenty of good intention, my mom did put some pressure on me to get a "back-up" degree, but, right now I can't see myself majoring in anything other than tuba performance. That's just the truth. I feel so sorry for the people who get degrees in stuff just to "get a job" and have no passion for it.

That is where I am right now, but my college life was not decided absolutely with a few mouse clicks when I was filling out my application. As sloan said, majors change FREQUENTLY and my job right now (as I would recommend anyone else) is to keep an open mind and explore all that is out there. I'm now seeing first-hand that college is about that exploration and seeing and being an active part in stuff that I've only read about, and I can almost guarantee you now that tuba performance will not be my major in the near future. In no way does that mean I will practice and play less. If anything, I'll work on practicing and playing MORE, but I do know that I love playing the tuba.

If I can stress any one particular thing, it's the approach to this point in life from a child's-eye view and with the most open mind possible. Expect the unexpected, be fearless in following what you love, and live in the now.

[/bibulously tumbles off of soapbox]

I totally agree with exploring options (trust me, each person should try to study what they enjoy doing...no reason to dread it), but keep in mind, unless you're loaded, time is money.

Just saying...

Joseph "who's known people to take up to 10 years finishing up an undergraduate degree, and that are still trying to pay off loans..."

MartyNeilan wrote:Earning an education degree is no promise of a job.

I hear ya.

Education is more marketable than Performance.

So, applying Sloan's philosophy to wanting to major in music - where one has a major instrument/private lessons as part of a curriculum( there are many other fields of music one may pursue) -, I'd say that education is the better route to take.

"The road less traveled is less traveled for a reason."(a) Indeed, Jerry has a point when mentioning this. Applied to this topic, the road less traveled is paralleled by the Music Performance degree.

Works Cited:
"The Baby Shower" Seinfeld. National Broadcasting company. 16 May 1991

thank you guys, this helps a lot. it sounds as if Ed would be the way to go, but i will not discredit sloan's novel. lol, thank you very much.