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I have just become the owner of a 1920's (late - serial 113xxx) refurbished King 4 valve Eb Sousaphone. The instrument came with a Plain label 24AW mouthpiece which I don't think suits it at all.

I have also tried a Perantucci PT84 and Dennis Wick 2L and 3L.

It seems to me that it requires a shallow mouthpiece.

What are peoples recommendations for this instrument as I don't have a local "Tuba" store that I can walk into and try.

I'm surprised it doesn't do well with the Wick 3L. If you think it needs a shallower mouthpiece, try a Mike Finn 4, even a Miraphone C4 (whatever the current number is), or what it probably came with, an old King 26. The MF4 did really well for me on a small bore eefer I borrowed some years ago. I sold it because I just never got into eefer, and I have other mouthpieces I like on my BBb's better.

You might try a Wick 3SL (shallow version of the 3L), Rudolf Meinl 9 with the .78 backbore, or the new Kanstul Eb-F mouthpiece (shallow bowl with a reasonably wide cup and very bright tone).

King Eb sousaphones came with a HN White #24 tuba mouthpiece. Good luck finding one of those!

Bell played his (last time I saw him in 1969) with a turned-down shank small Conn Helleberg. I believe Don Butterfield, who played a King Eb sousaphone from time to time used a skeletonized King 24 on his - but I can't testify to that. The Butterfield tuba mouthpiece is a skeletonized (excess metal removed from the outside) King 26, and nothing more. Comfy, but intonation was iffy in the top end.

I suggest you investigate Wick Eb tuba mouthpieces - the BBB guys play more Eb tubas than anyone else and I would guess more player use Wicks than anything else.

The King Eb sousaphone is the small bore as the BBb - .687 - which makes it very mouthpiece responsive, especially in regard to cup depth. My experience was deep cups make Eb Kings play pretty flat.

How this helps-

Mark Heter

Much thanks for your input Guys. Certainly given me a few options to hunt down.

Something like this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nickel-Eb-Tuba-Mout ... 0488554321

Wait a minute: what diameter are the bits? This needs to be checked, because I'm almost certain that the bits will be regular bits to receive an "American" .520 tip mouthpiece shank. If that is the case, then the bass trombone shanks and the Wick smaller (number, no letter) shanks won't fit. Check the bits. Also, the pair goes in a certain order, and if you mix them up, the best that will happen is that the mouthpiece doesn't fit properly, and the worst is everything can get so stuck that a trip to the tech is in order. If it has the smaller bits, then the Wick no-letter or the bass bone shanks will fit. But please check the bits before you get a mouthpiece so you'll know for sure.

It came with a new set of tuning bits that only seem to fit in one order. One fits fit all my current "L" mouthpieces fine and the other bit has a larger opening. Not near the horn at the moment so I can't measure them.

Being a newcomer to sousaphones, do you have to use both bits or is one OK? There is no way I could have both bits fitted and play the horn.

Your bits have different bores is part of the acoustic design of the instrument, so you need them both.

How wide a cup do you want? If you like a wide cup then the blokepieces #1 or #2 would provide you a shallow cup. I use #1 for my very smallest basses and the #2 for my large Eb basses including the Conn’s 26K and 28K. If the King is a shade lighter than the Conn’s the #1 might be best for you.

blokepieces are not very cheap and they are not widely available, but you may contact bloke via the sponsor pages or via his ad here on TubeNet.

Klaus

Yogy wrote:It came with a new set of tuning bits that only seem to fit in one order. One fits fit all my current "L" mouthpieces fine and the other bit has a larger opening. Not near the horn at the moment so I can't measure them.

Being a newcomer to sousaphones, do you have to use both bits or is one OK? There is no way I could have both bits fitted and play the horn.

Bingo! Any standard shank mouthpiece will fit. You would be surprised, or maybe not, how many players get them in the wrong order.

FWIW---I regularly play my mid-'30s King (American Standard) Eb sousaphone with a Kelly 18.

Paul

LOTP wrote:FWIW---I regularly play my mid-'30s King (American Standard) Eb sousaphone with a Kelly 18.
Paul

Indeed. I have two. Everyone should have one as a spare, and for inclement weather gigs. That is a mouthpiece that should sound good on the Eb souzy. I've played one or the other of my 18's on every tuba I've either owned, borrowed, or just played on. It may not be the "best" mouthpiece for any particular tuba, but I have yet to find a tuba that I couldn't use the Kelly 18 in a pinch and still get the gig done if I had to. Just make sure to wrap a ring of golfer's lead tape around the throat to stabilize dynamic extremes.

And here are three more rather shallow mouthpieces to choose from:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=42201" target="_blank

I have been using a Loud LM-15 with my Conn 28K, which is a 4 valve Eb sousaphone with about the same bore as the King. I also find this to be mouthpiece sensitive and the LM-15 is the one that gives me the most consistent intonation across the range. The Wick 3L works OK too, but I prefer the LM-15. As I recall the King has the smaller body with a full double loop while the Conn has the larger opening with the brace at the shoulder. I don't know how this would affect the mouthpiece selection.

Lew wrote:As I recall the King has the smaller body with a full double loop while the Conn has the larger opening with the brace at the shoulder. I don't know how this would affect the mouthpiece selection.

I am fairly sure how it affects the selection of King Eb sousaphone players.

Klaus, noting that the Conn’s 26K & 28K have a larger inner opening than the Conn BBb sousaphones. All Conn’s have the same outer diameter, but the Eb versions don’t have the smaller bore inner circle