TubeNet

My only question is...does it work for all brass instruments???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1sBRJVIxh0" target="_blank

Charles Atkins

I use them regularly.

BUT PLEASE NOTE - Just like anything else, using dent magnets requires a good deal of skill. If you don't know what you are doing and you start going crazy with these things, you can do a lot of damage in a hurry.

But, if you have some experience, they can be a great tool for quasi-severe dent work and I really like them for burnishing.

It looks like magic, but if you want good, clean results it is still hard work.

I use magnets A LOT. But... it's sure as hell not as easy as the video lets on!

NO NO NO!!!!

You are going to give someone the wrong idea. It can be done...very carefully, very slowly with the smallest flat magnet with a medium sized ball and LOTS of lubrication AND ONLY if you can't reach it with a rod.

I know you were joking, but the thought makes my skin crawl.

BRSousa wrote:NO NO NO!!!!

Do you mean you don't use magnetic dent tools?

bloke wrote:.... The trick (yup) is to use weaker magnets overall, and to finish with very weak magnets. Possibly some rookies (to their peril) will grab the ball the "fits" the bore of the large tubing the best - not understanding that the additional mass will (in the case of paper-thin tubas) wreck an expensive instrument. ....

I've found that an additional 'trick' is to use no cushioning on the face of the magnet other than a film of high-pressure grease. A rag across the face of the magnet will cause 'reverse tracks' and will also allow the unfinished inside of tubes to telegraph through to the outside. It also pays to be working on a horn that is clean on the inside.

I use the magnets every day. I just imagine using the magnets to remove delicate dings being akin to using a sledge hammer to drive in a tack.

It can definately be done, but you have to have experience and be very delicate. Just like everything else...

Yes, the magnets are very useful, but they definitely require a lot of skill. It takes a lot of practice to match the correct ball to the dent in question, and a lot of experimenting to come up with the correct technique for as little marring to the finish as possible. I still struggle with these a bit, but I'm getting there.

I am just curios, what quality of horns are all of you using the magnet dent tools on?

catkins522 wrote:My only question is...does it work for all brass instruments???

No.

I have never employed them in my work because I don't often work on marching instruments where cheap down and dirty dent work is the norm. In most cases, the tubas I work on are badly damaged and require extensive dent repair that is (for me) simpler to address in the traditional manor.

Its just my opinion but I think the magnet stuff is great on occasion and a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to use then the thousands of dollars worth of dent barrels, rods, hammers, burnishers, etc. that I use on a daily basis. Still, I will always encourage the average Tech to do everything they can to master the traditional methods using the tools before mentioned as the quality of your work will far exceed anything that can be done with the magnet tools.


Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works
http://www.oberloh.com" target="_blank

Daniel C. Oberloh wrote:Still, I will always encourage the average Tech to do everything they can to master the traditional methods using the tools before mentioned as the quality of your work will far exceed anything that can be done with the magnet tools.

I would change that around a bit and say the skills that are required to use the magnet tools properly are best developed using traditional tools.

The best users of power tools are the ones that know their hand tools.

Rick "who has enough power tools (and even a magnet tool) to have learned this the hard way" Denney

I do agree with what you say Rick.

I think the value is in understanding the behavior of the material (brass) and how it reacts when manipulated.

The magnet tools (in my opinion) are only a stop-gap gadget that can successfully rough out some dents on some instruments, yielding respectable results. But, it is really not capable of truly repairing the damage. Yes, on occasion, I am sure someone gets lucky and fixes a dent or two with really nice results. But, does the tool provide consistently repeatable good quality results? From what I have seen so far, the answer is no. Don''t get me wrong, this is a tool that has its place in the shop (not mine) as long as the hands putting it to use are well skilled and have a good understanding of what they are doing and the limitations of the device being employed. However, in the wrong hands it can turn what would have been a straight forward repair (using traditional methods) into an absolute nightmare. Also, knowledge of the fabrication and construction methods used by the manufacturer, can go a long way for the user of such tools so as to avoid making a bigger mess then what is started with. Just thought I would throw another 2¢ out.

Happy Holidays!


Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works

bloke wrote:I guess I'll just have to keep relying on luck, and I'll just have to allow others to rely on skill.

Now don't be like that Joe. You know what your skill level is and you know what I am talking about.

Happy Holidays man.

Dan'l

Joe,

We've gone away from using the plastic adhesive guards on the 20K, as they just didn't hold up in the field like teachers wanted. Just to give you a head's up.

Andy Smith
Parts Manager
Conn-Selmer

ASTuba wrote:Joe,

We've gone away from using the plastic adhesive guards on the 20K, as they just didn't hold up in the field like teachers wanted. Just to give you a head's up.

Andy Smith
Parts Manager
Conn-Selmer

That's a shame. I guess the plastic guards have received the same false bad stigma as Lexan mouthpieces.

Those self-adhesive, plastic guard wires are available from Ed Strege at Badger State supply...

tubarepair wrote:Those self-adhesive, plastic guard wires are available from Ed Strege at Badger State supply...

Automotive molding works well. The only difference is that the ones sold by Badger State have a prettier end treatment.

tubarepair wrote:Those self-adhesive, plastic guard wires are available from Ed Strege at Badger State supply...

and from us as well. Like I said, I don't mind the guards, but too many people in the south were complaining about them falling off of instruments in the heat and humidity. This change happened WAY before I got to Conn-Selmer, but they don't want to go back to that right now.

I guess my thought on the plastic strips, is that they weren't strong enough...
I understand the repair side of them, but as far as my experiences with them in corps, on some King 1151's, we got dents in the shoulder area that would not have happened with metal strips. The corps just peeled them right off when they figured out they were plastic...That was my biggest criticism of them, is that on a corps horn, it gave false hopes of the area being reinforced.
Now that I'm on the repair side...I can see where the plastic strips are helpful, but at the same time, the sousas I've seen, all but where the metal strip was, had been beaten to hell...