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In colleges, the Hindemith. Elsewhere Strauss horn solos.

bloke wrote:
...and to perform transcriptions of concerti that are composed so completely characteristic for the instrument they were originally written for...and to be so well-known and so strongly associated with the original instrument as well...

The Strauss Horn Concerto is much more melodic and pleasing to the ear than most of the music written for tuba. It was not written as a mere academic endeavor as were the slew of French Conservatory solos. (French Solo=Slow--Cadenza--Fast=Supposed Orgasmic Listening Experinece!!)

As a professional bass trombonist who performs solo recitals I go back and forth between wanting to play "good" music and trying to enjoy playing "academic crap." TM

Most of the commercially available bass-bone solo CD's include works by Bozza and Lebedev. The only people who will be moved by music of this nature are likely to be low-brass players. (and I do enjoy playing the Lebedev works)

I really enjoy hearing a good pro perform the academic standards. But for a moving musical experience, I would much rather listen to some good jazz, chamber music, or something that involves more creativity from the artist.

Kudos to Gene Pokorny for coming up with something different on his amazing CD "Big Boy." That is leadership by example. (We need more of that.)

We need some good music to play on tuba and bass trombone, instead of a huge number of "standard" works by second-rate composers. Where is the good music that will transcend our little closed society and reach out to a wider audience, without being cute or simplistic? Or, equally important, where is the good music that has great depth and is not necessarily appealing to a general audience (ala Kronos String Quartet)?

You can tell I have a stong opinion on this topic.

Mudman wrote:Where is the good music that will transcend our little closed society and reach out to a wider audience, without being cute or simplistic? Or, equally important, where is the good music that has great depth and is not necessarily appealing to a general audience (ala Kronos String Quartet)?

I REALLY dig Christian Lindberg's stuff. Most of his recordings are adventures instead of college jury material. Roger Bobo did the same thing. His groundbreaking stuff later became academic standards.

txtuba01 wrote:it kinda makes my head hurt trying to decide what to purchase next.

RA

Most everything Roger Bobo recorded is now a mandatory part of the tubist's library. I would start there.

bloke wrote:

In colleges, the Hindemith. Elsewhere Strauss horn solos.

You're 100% correct, and I never have been able to understand that.

The Hindemith Sonate (to me, even when played at it's best) comes off as a three movement toungue-in-cheek outing - as a near-virtuoso piano sonata with tuba accompaniment. The only tuba "solo" in the entire piece is stuck in the middle of the last movement...(sorta reminds me of the big tuba cadenza in the John Candy movie The Last Polka )...

I agree with your assessment of the Hindemith: it definitely gives even the best of accompanists a workout--especially in the 3rd movement. But it's such a monumental work from a chamber perspective that it's a must to perform. You learn so much about give and take in a piece like the Hindemith.

I've also heard infamous stories about Hindemith only writing what he could play when it came to ANY instrument....if this is true, in essence he could play any note that he wrote for any symphony, sonata, etc. that he ever composed....pretty neat, and would explain why his piano parts are so freaking rediculous (it being one of his prominent instruments), and would probably explain such a ponderous tuba part.

What the hey....it IS a sonata.....you're both supposed to bow at the end...just make sure you acknowledge the piano a couple more times than yourself....

Speaking of chamber works.....the John Williams Concerto is what I'm doing right now....wow.....it's SO different playing it with a piano.....but worth it all the same....fun piece, and seems to be rapidly joining the standard repertoire. Wish me luck this Wednesday in my studio recital--3:40PM at Rock Hall, Temple University for anyone in Philadelphia......

I also heard Alan Baer play the James Woodward Tuba Concerto....rediculous...what an amazing piece of music played by an amazing musician!! If I'm brave enough, I think that piece is going on my senior recital....date to be announced.....

Well....that's my $.04.....keep the change....

Allen V. Carter
Temple University
Tuba Holder
***Go OWLS!!***

Someone wrote:Gregson is an excuse to play a brass band solo, so look out for some more satisfying works that DO exist.

We somehow need to persuade concert fixers and conductor's that we can play a little bit more than the oh so V.W...

I find this opinion strangely prevalent among British tuba players, and to a greater extent than tuba players from other parts of the world. I suppose power sits poorly on those we grow up with. It isn't just tuba players. I hear more English music in the U.S., and when a friend visited London, he was surprised to find that the orchestras there were playing quite a bit of American music.

The problem with the Vaughan Williams is that everyone tries to take it seriously. It is musical and fun, as long as the fun is included. Of course, this applies to lots of music that is treated too seriously.

I've heard the Gregson with brass band, but I have to say it works better with orchestra. Hans Nickel makes a strong case for it on his Cantuballada CD, as I've said many times. It's like all music: Boring if badly played, or played just to be played. Nickel makes it glow in the dark.

Both are definitely modern works with a definite musicality and tonality. Thus, they are too philistine for the avant garde, yet too modern for traditionalists.

Both will appeal to audiences that would not tolerate, say, the Kraft Encounters II, despite Bobo's breathtaking recording of it.

Of course, the reason the Vaughan Williams is the only tuba concerto likely to be programmed is that Vaughan Williams is the only composer music directors have heard of who wrote one. The last 50 years has been a dry time for orchestral composing, and the only other well-known composer who wrote a tuba concerto during that time is a "movie composer" and therefore not on the list of worthies according to the musical literati. Too bad--it means we won't get a good recording of the John Williams, it would seem.

Orchestral music needs a composer who is a major star of the caliber of Wagner, Brahms, or even Strauss, etc., and tuba players are unlucky enough to live at a time when there are none.

Rick "who thinks the tuba can only be taken seriously as a solo instrument for about 30 seconds before an injection of humor is required" Denney

Rick Denney wrote: ... the only other well-known composer who wrote a tuba concerto during that time is a "movie composer" and therefore not on the list of worthies according to the musical literati. Too bad--it means we won't get a good recording of the John Williams, it would seem.

Don't forget the Broughton.

bloke wrote:summarizing:

imo, the fact that a monumental tuba concerto was composed by a "movie composer" is great news, and I suspect (from your choice of words) that you agree.

Of course I agree. But the elitists won't, and thus it won't get much opportunity for performance, and it's less likely therefore to get recorded with a good symphony orchestra. That's a pity.

And (to Mark), yes, I did forget the Broughton, though my description of the John Williams fits there, too. I keep thinking of the Broughton not as a concerto, but as a sonata. I wish there was a recording of it, too, with a real symphony orchestra.

Rick "who tires of piano accompaniment" Denney

Well, the Brahms horn trio sounds awesome done on F tuba, played down an octave from the horn part. and it doesn't have "horn calls" in it either. I'm still struggling to play it on horn, but I can play it relatively easily on my F tuba. Of course I don't have a problem with the clef.

MA

I totally respect the fact that the RVW is an important piece in our tuba history, I feel however that anyone that has the opportunity to perform a solo with an orchestra, that it is time to explore other pieces. I am glad to see that some pieces are starting to get some popularity. I would like to see that trend continue and perhaps lay off the RVW for a while. I know I will probably get ripped, so FLAME ON!!

Yeah. John Williams' Concerto. Great musical ideas, very virtuosic. Wish it could get more recognition with audiences.

Aubrey Foard wrote:Yeah. John Williams' Concerto. Great musical ideas, very virtuosic. Wish it could get more recognition with audiences.

I agree with Aubrey, it really is a good concerto. I remember not liking it at first, but the piece has grown on me. As far as how do we get lesser known pieces more recognition? Well the obvious answer is to perform them.....it is time that we find these lesser known works and perform them. That is the only way of these pieces will see the light of day. If we keep playing the same old standards over and over, then we might as well tell composers not to bother writing new music for us cause it will never get performed. Start thinking outside the box so to speak.