TubeNet

Hi-
Picked up my Xuqiu (who according to our friend Jonathan says it is actually made by Huasheng) micro travel 4 valve F tuba and case today,model # XCTA002 on AmTrack sent by Al from the Northwest.

Link to Xu Qiu:
http://xuqiumusic.com/" target="_blank

Link to Huasheng (even though this horn is not listed by them on their site):
http://www.hs-musical.com/en/" target="_blank

I have a gig later today which I am going to take my 6 valve F and this horn to check out.

It is a TINY horn--a "pocket tuba" or a "mini-me" tuba! Pitch seems quite good. UPDATE: The horn is GOLD BRASS, with a nickel silver lead pipe.
The horn, when using my small Helleberg, is stuffy, but when I go to a Bach 32E (never thought I'd use one of these!), it is very good. Tiny bore, and finger levers tiny, but horn is easy to play. It does have an adjustable thumb ring. No 'hooks' on the horn for connecting a strap for strolling (good--and with a horn this size, who needs them!). Also, the water key 'screw' was a tad loose--I tightened it up--I've seen this on almost all Asian horns--no big deal, but a good thing to check! Valves 3 & 4 do move in the opposite direction of valves 1 & 2. Here are some pics:

Front of horn, in case


Back of horn, in case


Horn and mute


Micro and JinBao #350 Bb tenor tuba


Case of micro


Horn is well built. Slides are all aligned, compression is excellent, lacquer is very good--it does have a slight chemical smell to it--must be the cleaning process--tomorrow, I'll run the garden hose with water through it. The case it comes in is excellent--finally a great case--plastic with metal trim, keys to lock case, great protection--CHINESE MAKERS--PLEASE--MAKE CASES LIKE THIS FOR ALL THE HORNS!!! Much better than the semi-hard black wheel cases {UPDATE: Latches are not the best on this case--even when locked--you need to be careful or case will open, as I found out--for extra safety sake, I will also use a bungee cord to wrap around case as an extra safety measure. Great case, but the latches need to be improved by the Chinese!!!}. Mouthpiece is not bad, but not for me-like a Bach 25. The mute I bought-Voigt-same as the M/W trolly (link: http://www.meinlweston.com/melton-meinl ... 4-246.html" target="_blank) uses--is superb (link to Voigt: http://www.wallace-daempfer.de/en/news.html" target="_blank ) --you could use this in a hotel room--no problem. I have a neotechstrap fabric case for it (link: http://neotechstraps.com/" target="_blank , and it attaches to the case--won't fit inside case. Notice the one pic with the JinBao Bb tenor tuba next to the Micro travel F tuba--this is for size reference.

Speaking of reference(s), a fine comparison of the M/W and the Asian travel tubas is done by our friend Jonathan - link: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44830&hilit=huashen+travel+tuba&" target="_blank of the M/W travel tuba by Heiko Triebener (in German) on Youtube-link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNRF0buv ... ideo_title" target="_blank Of course, the M/W travel tuba is currently over $7,500, and the Asian travel tuba is under $1,500--quite a difference!

Initial impressions of the Xuqiu: Horn plays very good with the right mouthpiece, and you need to remember this is a small bore--don't over blow!!! Would I say buy this as a F tuba replacement--NO--buy a regular F tuba for your uses. Would I recommend buying this horn as a practice tuba--HELL, YES!! This clone of the 'child's horn' (original made by Jestadt--their link: http://www.jestaedt-instrumente.de/frame.htm" target="_blank ) is quite impressive. I think Al, Jonathan, & Tom will have many orders for these, IMHO.

I have never played the M/W trolly, but this horn --for the price (the M/W is over $7,500)--is an amazing deal--at double the price it would still be a Great deal--HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!!!!

I just received my Kodak PlayTouch HD video camera today, so when I get some time, I will attempt to put YouTube stuff out on this horn.

More to follow--off to the gig.

UPDATE: The horn really looks like a 'Peck Horn.' I would describe the sound as sounding like a symphonic bass trombone (like a Shire bass t-bone as compared to a King 8B jazz bass bone). I used the Bach 32E, then went back to my small Helleberg--I am really going to do some mouthpiece testing this week, for sure. I also tried Nabucco on a break with the horn with the Bach 32E--does sound MUCH brighter-like a cimbasso. Playing something technical on it--like Thunder and Blazes March--is quite easy with the super fast valves!
Also, on the bell, it reads: 'Designed in France, Xu Qiu, Custom, Since 1978.'

Here are more pics:

CC 186 silver JinBao clone and micro:


JinBao 6v F and micro:


HAPPY FAMILY: JinBao #410 CC silver 186 clone, JinBao #600 6v F, JinBao #350 Bb tenor tuba, and micro F tuba.


Regards-
mark
jonestuba@juno.com" target="_blank

PS--Anyone wanting to drop by and try out this horn, or my other clones (CC 5 valve silver clone, 6 valve lacquer F, and Bb 4 valve tenor tuba), just give me a heads up and you are more than welcomed to check them out.
ALSO--looking forward to getting the Eb tuning slide to change this horn from F to Eb!

Hi-
I just saw a pic that Jonathan (a.k.a. "Neptune' of Wessax tubas) sent me of a satin silver with gold trim 'Bubbie' micro Huashen 4v F tuba--gorgeous travel tuba. Hopefully, he will post a pic of it either here or on the Sponsor section. Simply beautiful!
mark

PS These 'pocket tubas' are so much fun to play--having a blast with it!

jonesmj wrote:Hi-
I just saw a pic that Jonathan (a.k.a. "Neptune' of Wessax tubas) sent me of a satin silver with gold trim 'Bubbie' micro Huashen 4v F tuba--gorgeous travel tuba. Hopefully, he will post a pic of it either here or on the Sponsor section. Simply beautiful!

Here are some pics for you to enjoy. I will post information in Sponsors section and higher resolution pictures on my website.

I am so pleased you are enjoying yours Mark - these Bubbie tuba really are such fun to play!

That's a sharp looker, but having played a frosted silver Besson Imperial euph for a number of years, those things are a PAIN to clean (polish) and maintain.

I would love to get my hands on a JB comp euph or mini/tenor tuba in bright silver with gold highlights, though.

A fan club?

derrenba wrote:I would love to get my hands on a JB comp euph or mini/tenor tuba in bright silver with gold highlights, though.

I am sure that is possible. I already have the compensated euph on order with gold valve caps.

imperialbari wrote:

A fan club?

HI-
Either a fan club or a Siamese cat fan club...
mark

PS Beautiful little tubas Jonathan!! The gold brass one I have is more fun to play everyday!

bloke wrote:If I had something that small in F, I'd prefer a trumpet configuration.

Yes! Been there, had one, said that,...
Make one in a piston valve trumpet-shape, with 3 or 4 valves, and I'd consider one. I'm too tall to have such a small tuba otherwise.

jonesmj wrote:I would describe the sound as sounding like a symphonic bass trombone (like a Shire bass t-bone as compared to a King 8B jazz bass bone). I used the Bach 32E, then went back to my small Helleberg--I am really going to do some mouthpiece testing this week, for sure. I also tried Nabucco on a break with the horn with the Bach 32E--does sound MUCH brighter-like a cimbasso. Playing something technical on it--like Thunder and Blazes March--is quite easy with the super fast valves!

This is what that makes these things real world usable to people who don't need travel tubas- something that can fake bass trombone but still be familiar to a valve guy. And, as a 4 valve F, it'll be easier in the low bass trombone range which would otherwise require doing slide stuff on a valved Bb horn.
I'm getting something like that built up but in a different style.

Bob Kolada wrote:

bloke wrote:If I had something that small in F, I'd prefer a trumpet configuration.

Yes! Been there, had one, said that,...
Make one in a piston valve trumpet-shape, with 3 or 4 valves, and I'd consider one. I'm too tall to have such a small tuba otherwise.

jonesmj wrote:I would describe the sound as sounding like a symphonic bass trombone (like a Shire bass t-bone as compared to a King 8B jazz bass bone). I used the Bach 32E, then went back to my small Helleberg--I am really going to do some mouthpiece testing this week, for sure. I also tried Nabucco on a break with the horn with the Bach 32E--does sound MUCH brighter-like a cimbasso. Playing something technical on it--like Thunder and Blazes March--is quite easy with the super fast valves!

This is what that makes these things real world usable to people who don't need travel tubas- something that can fake bass trombone but still be familiar to a valve guy. And, as a 4 valve F, it'll be easier in the low bass trombone range which would otherwise require doing slide stuff on a valved Bb horn.
I'm getting something like that built up but in a different style.

Another idea would be to rewrap it into a pseudo cimbasso...

Hi-
Our friend, Jonathan of Wessax, just added new pics of the micro on his website, and has 2 new YouTube videos- one demonstrating the practice mute- which I can attest to that it works fantastic- and a video of the low range.
NOTE: For those who might say I should post this on the sponsor's forum--I can't do that --but would have if responses of non sponsors posts were allowed on that forum.

Mark

So is this the same "Bubbie" tuba that Neptune is selling in the UK or is it a different horn? I'd love something like this, but it would definitely need the Eb slides for me (and the practice mute as the little Princess is sleeping in the next room).

Al stopped by the shop with a few repairs for my guys to knock out. He was nice enough to bring with him a lacquered and silver plated example for us to check out. Fun toys. I myself would not have any real use for one but I could see them being usable as a really inexpensive substitute for a cimbasso. We were messing about with a 6/4 J.W. York BBb tuba project that Al wanted to check out and thought it would be fun to compare the two.



D.C. Oberloh
http://www.oberloh.com

Hi-
The micro Asian F 4v tuba is being called the Bubbie by Jonathan/Wessex in the UK and is the same horn as the one I acquired that is discussed in this thread. Asian travel/ micro/pocket/mini-me /'Bubbie' F tuba---same animal, with the soon to be available optional tuning slide to convert to Eb. And the practice mute that is available at an additional cost is even better than advertised! Best practice mute I've owned. Hope that helps. Good luck.
Mark

PS. AWESOME pic above!!!!

Where did you order the mute from?
B

Yes, the Bubbie is just name I use in the UK. It was suggested by the bassist, Herbie Flowers when he tried - thinking Travel tuba, or Mini tuba rather boring names for such a fun small tuba. The next Eb/F batch I will be getting from the factory will be engraved "Bubbie tuba"

I stock the practice mute which is made in Germany (the same as supplied to Melton/MW for their Trolley) and can supply world-wide - being light it is only $5 to ship to the USA (mute $135).

Here is video showing effectiveness of practice mute http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RioGU_1hl3Y

Jonathan, about the size of the horn. Is it about the same as an Eb tenor horn?

And about the maker, Mark says that his is Xuqiu and yours is Huasheng. Are those from the same maker or is it like some european makers that made look alikes from different factories? The pictures of the Xuqiu factory does not at all look like yours from the Huasheng. Does one chinese maker copy the european instruments and then other Chinese makers copy the first one or do they separately copy the original? This is somewhat confusing... For example on the link Mark provided I browsed away and found the small C-tuba XTA001 that by JinBao is called JBCB-400?! I have also seen my bass trombone with a couple of different Chinese names?! You may be able to shed some light over this?

If the Chinese instruments are indeed different but looks like each other then it is essential that the instruments we buy here are clearly marked or at least declared of it's origin I think. I have two Chinese alto trombones, for which I do not know the original makers, marked with different, european, brands that seems to be copies of the same original. However these two are very different even if they looks alike. You are very clear with that in your descriptions but there are many other out there that just put a brand name on something with unknown origin. This is essential so we can start to compare and discuss the different brands from China like we do with the different brands from other places in the world. I think there will be the same quality and other issues in chinese factories like there are in the rest of the world. Then things will start off to be real interesting and we are getting even more confused with the ever growing alternatives.

John, I wish I could fully answer you, but even to us selling Chinese instruments some of the links between companies is unknown and is very difficult to find out. The Chinese seem to consider these business secrets. I only know for certain where a model is made by visiting the factory and actually seeing being produced

I suspect the travel tuba sold by Xuqiu is in fact made by Huashen (where I saw it in production), but am not certain. There does seem to be some cases of what appears the same model made by different companies.

The JinBao JBBB-350 mini Bb appears identical to the C/Bb tenor tuba from Huashen - but while there does seem to be some tuning issues with the JinBao, I have not found with the instruments I have just got from Huashen.

Best guess is there are 1300 brass instrument manufacturers in China. Some are now very good (such as Huashen), while for others the quality is not so good. For all the instruments I sell, I just get one of a model initially to confirm of good quality and no playing issues before I stock (unless it has already been tried by Tom, or Al who have found it good - we liaise closely to supply the best instruments).

Dealers want to put their own brand on the models to provide a coherent line of products from what may be a variety of manufacturers (with names most buyers will not know and cannot pronounce), but obviously that does not help you know the exact origin. All you can do is always buy from trusted suppliers which you know check out the instruments and only sell those of best quality. Don't assume that what appears the same model sold cheap on eBay is the same instrument as that from a reputable dealer - it may not.

Neptune wrote:Yes, the Bubbie is just name I use in the UK....

Joe... think maybe "Bubba Tuba" would be appropriate for dealers in Tennessee and states south?

The true mark of success for the imports will be when Allied begins stocking parts for them.

I agree we have got to be wary!

I know all about how Chinese business works through my wife who has previous experience owning a dress shop in China. I rely a lot on her to judge the trustworthiness of local suppliers (she is a very good judge of character!)

It is when you see something like the following in the description of an instrument that you begin to think about reconsidering...:

'The intonation is good for students and amateur musicians, but for the professional it is not enough, so we recommend this baritone specifically for young players.'