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Hey guys,

I know a lot of you repair guys are masters at what you do, and I have a small question for you.

When you do prep work to send a horn for replating (to like andersons) do you take the horn apart and send it in pieces? I know it has to be buffed to a mirror shine, I was just wondering if a horn needs to be taken apart.

How do you work the valve caps? Do you take the laquer off of them also if you want them replated?

Mark

Bloke, Thank you so much.

Have I ever told you that you're my hero?

Mark

Just to slightly amplify Bloke's reply, an instrument that is to be bright silver plated does need to be buffed to virtual perfection. The plating process exaggerates every imperfection, so a less-than-perfect buffing job would result in a disaster. The instrument must be assembled and polished before plating. Assembling an instrument after plating would also be a disaster, as lead just LOVES to run on silver, and penetrates the silver plating all the way to the brass - just one solder run, and the newly-plated instrument would never look right. In fact, platers use a copper- or special silver solution to do a "striking", or pre-plating, which ensures that the final silver plating job will adhere to all the solder joints and nooks and crannies of the instrument. There is a tremendous amount of work involved in preparing an instrument for plating.

well, I'm considering getting some loose valves plated, or whatever Anderson does to them to get them to fit tightly again. Do I have to do anything to them first?
MA

MaryAnn wrote:well, I'm considering getting some loose valves plated, or whatever Anderson does to them to get them to fit tightly again. Do I have to do anything to them first?
MA

There's a little more to it than just getting the pistons plated. First, you have to make certain the casings are true. Once you determine what size the casings are, you can determine how big to make the pistons. When the pistons come back from Anderson's, they will have to be lapped to fit. The whole process requires a good bit of time and knowledge. You might want to consider unsoldering the valveset and sending the whole thing to Anderson's.

Plating your valves is as Mr Schultz says "a little more to it than just getting the pistons plated" actually, there is a lot more involved if you want good results. The tolerances and final shape of the piston and cylinders MUST be precise and that is not really feasable to do by hand. It requires very accurate tools and the knowledge to use them. Most shops need to send the whole valve block to the plater or rebuilder when having the work performed because the cylinders must be reshaped in most cases prior to resizing the pistons. This work is done on a special machine that is found in very few repair shops. The tolerances for the valve to cylinder are ,00075"-.001" or half a hairs thickness. In some cases the valve block does not require honing and does not need to be unsoldered from the body of the horn. I will check the casings with a special bore gage and if I find the cylinder in decent shape, I will determine what size the piston should be and have it plated and honed to size. I tend to have them done a little oversize about .00075 (give or take) because I like the fit to be snug enough to hand lap the casing and get the cylinder wall defects i.e. scratches and etch ironed out. If done correctly this will create a glassy smooth cylinder wall. In addition to plating, sizing and lapping, new guides will need to be made and properly fit. Anderson does great work and it will show in the way the rebuilt valves function provided the valve block installation is performed with the same skill and dedication to doing a good job.



I can go on and on with all the boring details but I expect you get the point.


Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works
Saving the world, one horn at a time...

MaryAnn wrote:well, I'm considering getting some loose valves plated,

A cheapo interim solution would be to use Hetman "Classic" Piston oil. It is designed for loose valves and helps improve their playability. I use it with reasonable success on my 70 yr old Martin, and I know of trumpet players who use it on well worn horns.

Rotor valves? Dah! said the technician as he strikes his palm against his head. Bloke is correct. Anderson does not do rotor plating but a few of us repair shops do. Mind you, it is a costly and time consuming process. There is at least two trips to the plater and a hell of a lot or machine work and hand lapping involved if you want the valves tight and smooth operating. There are a few big shops that the smaller shops send this kind of work to. I did for quite a while but after paying them a lot of money for very poor work and a lot of excuses from them for doing so, I gave up on them and just started doing it myself working with my local plating shops. Yeah, For tuba and euphoniums you will need to have your local tech pull the valve set and have them send it out for you ( piston or rotary horn) if you plan to have them rebuilt. Not a simple project which ever way you go about it.

Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works
Saving the world, one horn at a time...

I use a very thick valve oil for the worst of valves in my old collection, and until I get around to getting them all replated, it's a good temp. solution. Just also wanted to say thanks to all those repair guys for contributing, it makes fascinating reading.

www.euph9.freeserve.co.uk/neweuph.htm