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Hello, Tubenetters -

For the second time in four months, my wife and I have been asked to play in the pit orchestra of a stage production of "Thoroughly Modern Millie", this time in Champaign, IL. It's a great musical, and I'll be playing the 2nd Trombone book, which is clearly written for Bass Trombone and Tuba (and a blast to play). One small problem though - three songs call for Solotone mute, which I didn't have for the first production (they wouldn't have cared anyway). Given that the plot of the story is taking place in 1922 and a lot of the music is Ragtime, I assume this is referring to a Humes & Berg Stonelined Cleartone type mute. But, Humes & Berg doesn't make them for Bass Trombones, only Tenor, and I've checked other manufacturers' websites too. Unless someone has another suggestion, or knows where I can get a Solotone Bass Trombone mute, I guess my options are -

1. Ask the conductor if substituting a straight or cup mute would be okay
2. Buy a Cleartone Tenor Trombone mute and haul my Tenor Trombone in too (which could be difficult in the small pit I know we'll be playing in)
3. Buy a Cleartone Tenor Trombone mute, add more cork to it so it fits a Bass Trombone barrel, and be prepared to play everything down about a half step to compensate for pitch problems

If anyone has suggestions of good practice mutes for Trombones, that would be appreciated too. Okay, any ideas? Thanks, guys -

For a good practice mute, you should try the Best Brass mutes. A bit pricey, but really handy and effective.

http://www.hornguys.com/tbnbassmutes.php" target="_blank

What kind of tenor do you have? If it's a larger tenor (.547 or .562) with a a trigger why don't you just bring that and play the part? (assuming there are no low b naturals)

FWIW, a Harmon mute with the stem all the way in would probably be close enough....

I have the same issue with 'Mary Poppins.' I'm going to use my harmon....

I've got a .525" bore Tenor Trombone with an F valve (Yamaha YSL-684), and there's quite a lot of great deep passages in the part for Trombone. So, obviously covering the whole show with my .525" instead wouldn't work well. Humor intended, there's nothing like trying to substitute a Smith & Wesson for a Howitzer. I suppose I could take the Tenor to cover the Solotone parts, although in two of the songs that call for that mute quickly switching back to open Bass Trombone for significant low parts would be difficult, especially in the small pit we'll be in. I could also make hauling the Tenor in more worthwhile by using it at times when a lighter sound would be nice (I did that in the other production we played for).

I was wondering if a Harmon mute would be a good substitute for a Solotone, so I'll take that advice. Any suggestion for a good brand would be appreciated. And the Best Brass practice mutes look interesting too, although I have thought about spending the extra money for a Yamaha Silent Brass System, so as to be less concerned about overblowing (I tried one years ago, and liked it). The Best Brass E-Mute looks like it could be good alternative to a Silent Brass System though.

Thanks for the reply -

Tony - Have fun playing "Mary Poppins". We'd love to play that show someday too. At least I now know of someone else looking at substituting a Harmon for a Solotone.

I played that show recently, all on a small tenor. In my opinion, when playing in a reduced orchestra, you should consider what parts are important to be heard and what parts aren't that important or can be put in a different octave without losing context. I considered using a big tenor but decided the context called for a small tenor and the low stuff simply is not that important and probably wouldn't be heard anyway... and it was being doubled on the keyboard so those notes were covered. Harmon is not a good substitute simply because... it might sound fine to you, but the audience would never even hear it.

Play it on bass with whatever mute you have that fits. Close enough.

Unfortunately there is no substitute for the solotone mute so if you need that sound you have to use such a mute. In the case you need a b trbn Bloke's suggestion is great. However as Doug who have played the show says you have also the option to do some planning and do it the way he suggests. Using another mute is not an alternative if you would like to sound like a solotoned trbn. There is nothing like it.

You can get very close by adding cork (or even duct tape) to an H&B cleartone. If you put on enough the pitch is actually not completely unworkable.

One of the prominent repair guys in Texas (Eric Swanson maybe? Eric Edwards?) modifies these in a way that I've heard good things about.

I actually own a beautiful handmade bass trombone solotone, handmade by Paul Lawrence in England. It looks and plays great, no pitch problems. No, I won't lend it out

I got it when I was there for a trombone festival, but it might be possible to get one through a British retailer like Phil Parker's.

At Poppins on Broadway, a Harmon is used for the one note that is marked with Solotone. I haven't played Millie in a while so I don't recall, but I think the Harmon was also used instead of the Solotone for the one or two notes where it's marked.

Gabe is correct that bass trombonist and brass technician Eric Swanson in Dallas does a great job modifying a mute to make it into a Solotone for bass trombone. If anyone would like his contact information or photos of this mute contact me.

Joe Stanko

For one or two notes I wouldn't worry about it, but Millie is a period piece that has a few solo lines that pretty much need that certain sound that you don't get with anything but a TENOR with solotone. I'm sure you can make a solotone that fits a bass, but what does it sound like? Does it project for solo lines and sound appropriate? I doubt it, just like harmon doesn't sound appropriate.

The OP said he's playing the 2nd/bass/tuba book, but no mention of whether the 1st book is being covered, which is where the solo lines are. I used mostly the 1st book with a few things from the 2nd, and one one tune I think I played a bass clarinet part. The keyboardist was banging out bass lines so there was no real need for the bottom part in most of it.

Wow, several insightful replies -

Bloke - Leaning a Tenor Trombone on a Bassoon/Bass Clarinet stand with a Solotone mute stuck in it specifically for grab-and-go easiness could work. But, having the time to stick a Solotone mute in is not a problem in this show, so I'd opt to just use a Trombone stand instead. Nice idea, though.

Doug - I'm sure we'll have someone covering the 1st Trombone part, so I know I'll cover most (if not all) of the Trombone parts in the 2nd book with our Bass Trombone, pumping out the low parts for fun and effect. I'll make sure they're heard, too (without going overboard, unless called to).

John - Give me a choice between using a mute that's called for or substituting another, and I'll always try to get the mute that's called for. And it looks like Gabe and Joe might have a good answer.

Gabe - Rats (about not being able to borrow yours). I can't blame you, though. Your Paul Lawrence Solotone sounds like it's great. You and Joe Stanko are right about Eric Swanson being the guy who builds Bass Trombone Solotones out of Humes & Berg straight mutes. I've got his email address, and may order one from him (thanks anyway, Joe). He charges $85 plus shipping and $12 for insurance for one.

And whoever linked this thread from the Off Topic forum to the TubeNet forum, thanks for the additional exposure. I was wondering if I should have posted this thread there anyway.

Thanks, everyone -

A followup - After eight great performances, we closed our run of "Thoroughly Modern Millie" at CUTC yesterday afternoon. The kids on stage were great, we played to packed houses (or close enough), and the 20 member orchestra was a blast to play in. With the orchestra being that size, I played all the Trombone parts in the 2nd Trombone book on Bass Trombone. So, I bought a Bass Bone Solotone mute from Eric Swanson for $97, and I'm glad I did. Eric builds a nice mute (he's a Bass Trombonist himself), and it beat hauling in our Tenor Trombone just to be able to opt for a less expensive Solotone. Logistically, having three big horns in the orchestra to play would have been a problem too, and I'm primarily a Bass Trombonist anyway. Most performances both Trumpets and both Bones had Solotones, which sounded really cool as well. I'm sure I can find other opportunities in the future to use that mute too.

For the Tuba parts, I used my Tubenet namesake, which turned out to be nice size horn for parts and orchestra. A slightly larger horn would have been nice at times, but our 2J was still a good fit for the part. Anyway, it's a fun show to play, and thanks again for all the suggestions and banter on the topic

Oh, by the way - Right when I hit "Submit", I remembered that I forgot to mention that I also bought a Jupiter TE70 Tuba/Euphonium stand to use in this show ($64 at Woodwind and Brasswind Shop). It might not do so well with a really big tuba, but for a horn the size of a 2J or slightly larger, they're fine. And in this show, it was great having the 2J bell-up right beside me, especially since I was seated on a foot tall single platform with my 2J on the floor. There were a few quick changes from Bone to Tuba or visa versa for which that stand proved very convenient!