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Hello all!

I have been thinking of joining the world of Eb tubas. Any suggestions/comments/thoughts etc on them? I'm particularly interested in thoughts on the Willson 3400.

I was told that Eb tubas are notorious for having intonation issues. Is this true?

What tuba would you suggest?

Thanks for any replies!

Chris

SFA Tubajack wrote:I was told that Eb tubas are notorious for having intonation issues. Is this true?

I can't say about the Willson, but I would say to generalize most Eb tubas have more secure intonation than F tubas.

Playing Eb tuba is like anything else. It's all about your sound concept. For me, Holst is for Eb. Especially the first and second suites. I've played them on CC and BBb and for whatever reason I just think that it sounds better on Eb. If you have a specific concept for something where Eb works better than what you're playing go for it. otherwise you'll end up regretting it and you'll wish you'd saved your money.

As for the intonation issues, this is mostly based on the old American Eb's, where the bellflares in the giants and monsters where too rapid and therefore caused the intonation issues. Nowadays its not so bad but everyone has his biases. when I was buying my first tuba my teacher was convinced that all German tubas had intonation issues, so I didn't buy a Perentucci. Clearly lots of people play on those horns and do very well with them. There are some good horns and some lemons. If you can play it before hand and you'll know if it has the right intonation.

I own a Willson 3400 and it's a great instrument. Best valves of any piston horn I've ever played, very good intonation (not perfect, top line A needs some adjustment) but on balance it's intonation is spot on. I prefer Eb over F and don't even own an F. Once I compared them side by side in college, I chose Eb and never went back. I'm sure F tubas are way better these days (most everything is) but only you can decide which works best for you. Play a few and see what you think.

Anytime someone says something beginning "All Eb tubas..." or "All Fords..." or "All turnips..." , you know its time to take that statement with a not a grain of salt but a lot more. (especially all turnips!) I used to play an Eb tuba which had better intonation than any other tuba I've played of any key, and now play one not quite as good in intonation, but gutsier in sound.

I'm incredibly fond of my E flat and have no intonation problems whatsoever. It works great as an all round-horn, and I've used for all sorts of ensembles including wind orchestra, symphony dito, brass quintet and brass band. And it's also perfect for solo works.

The only setting so far when I have not been fully satisfied with it is when I played some larger symphony orchestra repertoir. But that is obvious considering it's not a huge horn. For lighter stuff it's great, though. And also works well on Bydlo and other famous excerpts (except maybe The Valkyries, however Patrick Harrild does an excellent version of it on his E flat in a youtube video).

I have an old York Monster E flat that I have used as my bass tuba since 1978 (clearly I like it!). I do not find the intonation of the E flat tuba any better or worse than any other key tuba.

best,
Mark

what i personally like about EEb tubas over FF's is the depth of sound, i love how much depth of sound an EEb gives you over an FF tuba,



-Wes

Thanks all for the replies! This has eased my apprehension of Eb tubas quite a bit.

I have only been playing F tuba for just a little over a year, and may not have completely learned it, but I am very comfortable with it. Due to the size and quality of my current horn I feel it is time to upgrade. I've always been a fan of traditional brass bands and know that they use Eb's and BBb's, but just fell into the mindset that dominates my area that the "better" instruments are CC and F, hence the reason that a CC was my first purchased horn and an F was my second. I had been looking at larger F tubas, such as a B&S PT-10 or a MW 45S-LP, but recently began looking into Eb's, such as the 3400. I would much rather a piston tuba and have heard nearly all good things about Willsons. Guess I'll just have to play around on them and find out!

Thanks again for the help!

Cheers,

Chris

Hello I have played only Eb for 30 years last year I bought a Bb tuba and a Bb Euph teaching myself these two instruments was great fun and has helped me extend my usable range on Eb by nearly an octave.
I own 3 eb tubas and an eb Sousa intonation is not a problem on any of them.
If brass band is where you want to play Eb tuba be ready to transpose as the parts will be in treble clef there are various tricks you can use but it will complicate your playing at first.
For years I thought that Eb was the only tuba to play,it is closest to a do everything tuba and many people in Ireland and the UK do just that.
But playing other keys and doubling on a related instrument has made me a better Eb player.

Eb is my preferred horn, and the horn I bring when I don't know what's on the agenda. It can do it all. I've always preferred compensating Ebs, and prefer 3+1 setups for ultimate flexibility; it precludes the need for 5 or 6 valves and the Bessons are damn good on the intonation. I've played the Willson and it's nice, but it's not quite as flexible to me as the Besson, but a bit more open in the bottom (resistance wise).

J.c.S. (sadly between Ebs at the moment)

My "F" is a 983. I never got used to the response or intonation of F tuba. And if I'm ever told the Eb is too big for the assignment, I'll get out my Bb. No more F tubas for this guy.

jeopardymaster wrote:My "F" is a 983. I never got used to the response or intonation of F tuba. And if I'm ever told the Eb is too big for the assignment, I'll get out my Bb. No more F tubas for this guy.

+1. I tried F tuba my last year of college and even did most of my required recital on it . Never really got used to the response and intonation of F tubas, and the sound didn't fit my sound concept. I prefer a deeper, fuller, more husky sound than any F tuba is capable of making. Eb is my 'high horn', I guess, but they also make great quintet horns.
Gimme an Eb, CC, or BBb tuba and I'm fine

sousaphone68 wrote: ...If brass band is where you want to play Eb tuba be ready to transpose as the parts will be in treble clef there are various tricks you can use but it will complicate your playing at first...

Isn't that the finesse with an Eb tuba in brass band where the parts are written in treble clef? Then it is just to play like any other instrument in the band except for the G-bass trombone that is in bass clef? I have tried to forget the treble clef fingerings and read/play the written tones in bass clef, not transposing, playing the Eb tuba, and that is a bit tricky. I.e. forget and relearn that an Eb should sound Eb.

The other day for the first time ever, at least for me, we got a piece where the tuba part was written in F, bass clef, and said Tuba in F. Now that sounded very contemporary until our tubist tried to play it in F... The only other instance of bass clef transposed I have seen before was the contra bass trombone part for Schoenberg's Gurrelieder that was written in G which also sounded terrible until the player realized it...

Another Eb player here (Besson 983). I don't play Eb for any particular reason, except that the Besson just seemed to fit me when I tried one in college, and my teacher and I decided it was the right instrument for me. It is the only tuba I own, and frankly, if you're gonna have just one tuba, I think a good Eb is the best way to go.

Another Eb player here (Besson 983). I don't play Eb for any particular reason, except that the Besson just seemed to fit me when I tried one in college, and my teacher and I decided it was the right instrument for me. It is the only tuba I own, and frankly, if you're gonna have just one tuba, I think a good Eb is the best way to go.

+1 We may disagree about make or model, but we agree on the seemingly universality of the Eb.

I'm a 982 player and while I like the Eb a lot, I find the the 3 +1 valve combination difficult to use in low fast passages.

Having the fourth valve on the left hand creates a situation where the left brain has to tell the right brain to activate the left fingers and I am finding the right brain is not cooperating as quickly as the left brain wants it to.

I also find the compensating feature of the instrument causes the horn to feel very stuffy below low Bb, making soft gentle entrances down low very hard to produce.

Gilligan wrote:I'm a 982 player and while I like the Eb a lot, I find the the 3 +1 valve combination difficult to use in low fast passages.

I think that is a lot to do with what you originally learnt and are used to using. Most British player find the 3+1 valve system easier for fast passages in low register.

Neptune wrote: I think that is a lot to do with what you originally learnt and are used to using. Most British player find the 3+1 valve system easier for fast passages in low register.

Definitely agree there. The Eb I owned prior to my current Willson was a Boosey Sovereign Eb and it was a wonderful instrument with an amazing sound but I could never really get used to the 3+1 valve configuration. Like Gilligan, I also am not a fan of the compensators. For me, the ones I've played do feel a little stuffy in the low end. I also never achieved the desired result with intonation so all the notes chromatically down to the pedal simply weren't there. It's ironic too, because just looking at the Boosey and the Willson, I would say the Boosey is a bigger horn. That bell on the Boosey is really big. But the Willson puts out way more sound for me and is truly a "do everything" kind of horn.

The Willson big-bored Eb and the Bessons/Booseys are indeed very different. But you learn to deal with the "stuffiness" by slow air... over blow 'em or try to force anything and they'll respond... unfavorably, with poor intonation and awful response. I've mentioned this on trombone fora as well... slow air for smaller bores, not high-pressure air.

The Willson is a nice horn, but I'd be loath to play some pyrotechnical stuff on a 5-valve system; for me, the "double tuba" configuration is just super facile for that.

To each their own If you like the big valvers, the Meinl Weston is a nice beast too; I'd love to try the rotary version.