Bill Bell's Martin CC (actually LB Olivers horn) Bookmark and Share

The bulk of the musical talk
Forum rules
Reminder: "Go fund me" requests are not allowed and should be reported. All requests will be deleted.

Bill Bell's Martin CC (actually LB Olivers horn)

Postby Dan Schultz » Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:39 pm

Does anyone know the whereabouts of the Martin CC that Bill Bell is playing is this picture?
Image
Last edited by Dan Schultz on Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan euph, King 2341, Alphorn, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10246
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby kingconn » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:04 pm

That was L.B. Oliver's horn. He might have an idea.
mike
kingconn
bugler
bugler
 
Posts: 100
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2004 11:20 am
Location: winston salem n.c.

.

Postby TheHatTuba » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:11 pm

.
Last edited by TheHatTuba on Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
TheHatTuba
5 valves
5 valves
 
Posts: 1150
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Desert

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Michael Bush » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:18 pm

.
Last edited by Michael Bush on Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Michael Bush
FAQ Czar
 
Posts: 2339
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Dan Schultz » Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:25 am

I've heard back via email from a couple of experts in the field of tubas. The tuba Bill Bell is playing is thought to be a Sander tuba.... which is thought to be the origin of the 'slant-rotor' concept. I am in touch with L B Oliver but haven't heard back from him.

Can anyone put names on the picture and what kind of tubas they are playing?
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan euph, King 2341, Alphorn, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10246
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

.

Postby TheHatTuba » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:12 am

.
Last edited by TheHatTuba on Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
TheHatTuba
5 valves
5 valves
 
Posts: 1150
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Desert

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Frank Ortega » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:23 am

The shape of the bell and bows look exactly like my Martin Renowned(medium).
Martin did offer rotary valve instruments, perhaps the valves were ordered from Sanders? Also, John Moore, a San Francisco Trad Jazz player, had a Martin Medium CC with 3 valves and a recording bell, so I think it's very possible that Martin made a few one off CC tubas. Hope that beauty is rediscovered!
Frank Ortega
Band Director
Saddle Brook MS/HS
The Bloomfield Civic Band
Music Director/Conductor
Bon Temps Brass
Frank Ortega
4 valves
4 valves
 
Posts: 610
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: New Jersey, USA

.

Postby TheHatTuba » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:30 am

.
Last edited by TheHatTuba on Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
TheHatTuba
5 valves
5 valves
 
Posts: 1150
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Desert

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Frank Ortega » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:47 am

I believe it was factory original CC. He said he bought it decades before out of a store window in downtown SF. It certainly didn't look cut.
Frank Ortega
Band Director
Saddle Brook MS/HS
The Bloomfield Civic Band
Music Director/Conductor
Bon Temps Brass
Frank Ortega
4 valves
4 valves
 
Posts: 610
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: New Jersey, USA

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby tuben » Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:31 pm

TheHatTuba wrote:Jerry Lackey appears to be playing a very early MW Bill Bell model w/ string linkages.


Did such a beast ever exist? Complete with the long, tapered spatulas like on a King Symphony?

Perhaps it is a King Symphony?
tuben
 

.

Postby TheHatTuba » Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:49 pm

.
Last edited by TheHatTuba on Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
TheHatTuba
5 valves
5 valves
 
Posts: 1150
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Desert

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Paul Scott » Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:19 pm

I was told that this photo shows a rotary Martin CC, played by Jay McAllister. I don't recall where this photo came from but thought I'd share it since the topic came up. Back in the 'teens, Martin offered every valved brass instrument in either piston or rotary valves.

Image
Paul Scott
pro musician
pro musician
 
Posts: 400
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 9:11 am

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby KiltieTuba » Sat Dec 01, 2012 5:43 pm

Any idea on the BART in the back row on the right?
KiltieTuba
6 valves
6 valves
 
Posts: 4991
Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:31 am

...

Postby Deleted dp » Sat Dec 01, 2012 5:58 pm

...
Last edited by Deleted dp on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Deleted dp
 

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby tuben » Sat Dec 01, 2012 9:16 pm

DP wrote:Image

What I like about this photograph is 9 guys and 9 different horns...


+1
tuben
 

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Alex C » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:21 pm

Kilte,

I'm taking a wild stab at the BART on the back row based on a faded memory of having seen this picture with the person identified years ago.

I think the person is Jay McAllister and the tuba is a Martin rotary valve CC. Jay played tuba for the the Chamber Brass Ensemble which was the quintet for the first Music Minus One recordings. He was a freelance player in NYC and, again faded memory, I think he moved to Puerto Rico to teach public school band. A fine musician.

Correct me if I'm wrong.
Last edited by Alex C on Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
City Intonation Inspector - Dallas Texas
"Holding the Bordognian Fabric of the Universe together through better pitch, one note at a time."

Practicing results in increased atmospheric CO2 thus causing global warming.
User avatar
Alex C
pro musician
pro musician
 
Posts: 2087
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 11:34 am
Location: Cybertexas

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Dan Schultz » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:17 am

I spoke with LB Oliver this evening. The horn Bill Bell is playing WAS LB's horn. LB said the bell was engraved 'Martin'. There is some discussion that the horn could have been a Sander.

Here's a 'twist'... LB mentioned that the bell rim looked as if the bell had been cut and rerolled around the rim wire by hand. I'm thinking there might be a good story here.... like maybe the valve section and top & bottom bow could have been Sander and the bell came from a Martin. LB said he sold that horn to Ivan Hammond maybe 10-12 years ago.

About the tall horn at the right in the back row... The only horn I've ever seen with a detachable 'stovepipe' bell was on a Reynolds 'contempora'... like the one shown below with a small Reynolds.
Last edited by Dan Schultz on Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan euph, King 2341, Alphorn, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10246
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby bort » Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:24 am

Kind of a crazy looking leadpipe loop on that Martin CC!
B&S 4198 (PT-7P)
User avatar
bort
6 valves
6 valves
 
Posts: 9382
Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:08 pm
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby UncleBeer » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:09 am

TubaTinker wrote: Ivan Hamlin (sp?)

Ivan Hammond maybe?
User avatar
UncleBeer
pro musician
pro musician
 
Posts: 1479
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 2:07 am

Re: Bill Bell's Martin CC

Postby Dan Schultz » Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:18 am

UncleBeer wrote:
TubaTinker wrote: Ivan Hamlin (sp?)

Ivan Hammond maybe?


Yes. (Sorry about the poor spelling, Ivan!). I've since learned (from an email forwarded by Don Harry from Ivan) that Ivan did in fact own that horn for a while and sold it to a student in Ypsilanti.

(edit)... LB sold the horn to Sam Gnagey and bought it back some time later. Maybe when LB catches up with this post, he'll furnish a timeline on the horn.
Last edited by Dan Schultz on Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan euph, King 2341, Alphorn, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10246
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

Next

Return to TubeNet

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], spirtuba and 28 guests