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My highschool band is playing Holst's first suite in Eb and I was curious about wether to play contrabass or bass tuba. I'm first chair in a section of four and I'm the only one with a bass tuba. And if it helps, it's a small F tuba

Ask your band director.

THE TUBA wrote:Ask your band director.

As a player AND a band director...

Again ask your director. I play it with an Eb bass and the other tuba in the group is a BBb. It works very well that way. There are a few sections where playing the upper and lower part add to the presentation of the piece.

EDIT: I just realised I'm addressing my own worries, and not the original question. Sorry, but someone seems to be answering this, so I can't delete it.

EDIT: But I can edit it - irrelevant material removed.

My director likes the idea

TinyTubist97 wrote:My highschool band is playing Holst's first suite in Eb and I was curious about wether to play contrabass or bass tuba. I'm first chair in a section of four and I'm the only one with a bass tuba. And if it helps, it's a small F tuba

Unless your director is really familiar with Tuba and brass he/she will only know based on how it sounds. Just grab the horn and try it. If it is disliked either you or the director will notice.

If your band is running four contrabass tubas, I would say the replacement of one (or two of these) to bass tuba would be a smart idea at all times, not just for this work.

The First Suite was originally written for a much smaller ensemble, around 19-20 players, perhaps one or two of these would have been tubists, one playing a bass and one a contra. Although, time and apparently research has shown that this piece can be stretched to much larger numbers, outside of an educational setting you would have to wonder why.

Have fun with this piece, it is a great music.

People with small tubas can't play low octaves? Is your big tuba compensating for something?

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with playing in octaves. The two tone colours are rather different. Parts are rarely marked as bass or contra, instead players and conductors/musical directors make the call. Different ensembles run different line ups.

In my perfect world a wind ensemble, or military band, would contain around 45 players, two of these would be flute players, 8 would be clarinettists, two of these would be tubists (one bass, one contra) and the others would be made up of people playing one per written part. Wind instruments are loud contraptions; so often you see and hear bands with ridiculous numbers of people, which seems to have no place except perhaps for education (letting everyone have their go), or novelty, ie the dreaded massed band.

The score page had to be shrunk to match the 256K limit. Still it should give the definitive answer:

No tuba has anything to do at the upper octave line, which is solely written for the euphoniums.

Regretably the brass band arrangement has this passage for Eb and BBb tubas playing in octaves, which gives very much less clarity.

The octave G is there because the mounted bands traditionally used 3 valve compensators rather than the 3+1 compensators used in the on-foot bands. The 3 valve Eb tuba would not be able to play the low G.

Klaus

Missouri wrote:Also, does this bother some of you that a freshman has an F tuba? When I was in school, this is what the graduate students bought.

+1

Grooving for Heaven wrote:

imperialbari wrote:

Skærmbillede 2013-03-03 kl. 01.45.52.png

The score page had to be shrunk to match the 256K limit. Still it should give the definitive answer:

No tuba has anything to do at the upper octave line, which is solely written for the euphoniums.

Regretably the brass band arrangement has this passage for Eb and BBb tubas playing in octaves, which gives very much less clarity.

The octave G is there because the mounted bands traditionally used 3 valve compensators rather than the 3+1 compensators used in the on-foot bands. The 3 valve Eb tuba would not be able to play the low G.

Klaus

that's exactly what I tell my kids. In older band music, octaves are written for the benefit of those who played 3 valve Eb tubas, and as long as you can play the low notes, you should.

In general, I think that is true. The function of the tubas in band is completely different than in orchestra. You are the omni-present bass sound in a band, whereas in an orchestra, you are more of a soloist/member of a quartet, with the occasional tutti bass voice participation.

There is that one spot in the 1st movement of the Eb Suite, in the "Peasante" section, where everyone should really jump to the upper part (assuming they are able to), because the musical line really demands it.

To the OP:

Give it a try. If it doesn't work out (intonation, blend, etc.), don't be afraid to switch back to the big horn.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. It's not a life-or-death decision . . .

tuba_dan wrote:If your band is running four contrabass tubas, I would say the replacement of one (or two of these) to bass tuba would be a smart idea at all times, not just for this work.

Assuming all 4 players are strong players, yes. But in a lot of bands, that's not always true.

Another idea... just play it up the octave on your CC. It's not *that* high, and if the director says no, then you don't have to switch horns.

Why? Would it be worrisome if he had a trombone, a euphonium, a sousaphone,...?

Missouri wrote: It bothers me that a high school student has a bass tuba and wanting to use it in ensembles. As I said, when I was in school only graduate students and those serious about winning an orchestral job had these horns.

Yeah, but that's a side issue. Not really relevant to the original question.

The kid has an F. He'd like to use it in band. They're playing a piece where it might work, and his band director doesn't object.

That seems (to me) to lead to an overwhelming: "Give it a damn try and see how it works!!"

Missouri wrote: Also, does this bother some of you that a freshman has an F tuba? When I was in school, this is what the graduate students bought.

No

If the kid is serious then he will have a leg up on his peers by having a 4+ year head start on the f tuba. I had to learn the keys of tuba my junior year of high school cause my teacher, Dr. John Richards, thought it was important. The first tuba that I owned was an f tuba. Would I go back and do if differently? Nope. Did it ruin my playing? Nope. No need to harp on this guy just because he got an f tuba earlier than you did.

Remember this piece was written for British military band which would have had Eb tuba and BBb tuba. If small band, then likely just an Eb tuba.

If you have F tuba and there are three contrabass tubas, use the F. The bass tuba will provide a bit of clarity as expected by Holst.

How so Joe?

I believe Shakespeare wrote about this.