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We make a lot of the insignificance of the key of a horn for various applications here, but I am curious about brass band culture. What in reality would happen if I showed up for a brass band audition with a CC or an F? Nothing? Laughed at? Shot on sight? Tied down to a chair and forcefully converted?

I am sure the rep would probably be "easier" to play with traditional instruments and the fingerings that come along with them, but having been raised and educated as a trumpet player I don't really make a lot of the differences between instruments. After about the 3rd different instrument key learned, it just stops being a big deal.

I have played in many a wind ensemble, but never a brass band. How serious is the instrument key issue?

I think in these parts (IL) the key is more of a suggestion than a rule.

For contesting brass bands, it is the rule. For others, can you transpose at sight, if you are allowed into the room by traditionalists?

To my knowledge, NABBA does not insist upon BBb and Eb tubas, even for the annual Competition.

Chicago Brass Band, Illinois Brass Band and Prairie Brass Band all have (or recently have had) CC and F horns among the members.

Now, if you were in NZ or the UK...

Steve Marcus wrote:To my knowledge, NABBA does not insist upon BBb and Eb tubas, even for the annual Competition.

This is correct, per NABBA 2013.

If you play well (in tune, especially) and don't tell anyone, who is gonna know?

From the NABBA contest rules: "Parts designated for Eb or Bb Tuba may be
played on tubas in any key."

EDIT: I just read the 2012 revision of the British national Championship rules, and they specify "Eb and EEb Bass, Bb and BBb Bass" and make no mention to exceptions for other keys. I've seen it stated that CC and F have been used there in the past, but can't know for sure. Hopefully some of our British members will weigh in.

The best thing is to use the "Don't ask, don't tell" philosophy for an F or CC. Tell them it's a BB flat or E flat - if you play good enough, they will not care.

The big faux pas is to show up for an Eb spot with a big horn. If you want to play cornet in brass band, show up with a corner not a trumpet. Ditto for just about everything else, save maybe the Eb cornet part. Usually they're happy to have a guy with any kind of high pitched trumpet-like thing (I've seen Eb trumpet and piccolo trumpet work well there).

I've run into a few 'snots' in the brass band World who consider anything other than Eb and BBb tubas AND treble clef music for trombones, euphoniums, and tubas absolute blasphemy!

It's my contention that it just doesn't make any difference from 'behind the curtain'.

I have 4 CC's in my brass band.

The problem has got nothing to do with grumpy old guys who thinks they know best. In my opinion, at least. It's about sound concept. Generally, the sound of a compensated british tuba is better suited for typical british style brass band that want's to sound like a typical british brass band. Try go playing piccolo trumpet on the soprano chair in England and it would not matter how perfect you would play everything, it's about the sound. The sound brass bands in general want to have is generally more easily achieved with the intended instruments.

I was tired of having to ask to explain to people why my bell pointed In the other direction so I just made a top action CC. Now everyone is happy.

At an audition, you shouldn't have any problem showing up with a CC or an F tuba, especially in North America. Most of the brass bands in North America I've played with and seen perform have a non-traditional assortment of tubas (not all 3+1 BBflat and EEflat). If they are sticklers for tradition, they'll likely have a set of instruments for you to play anyway and as such, the instrument selection for the audition shouldn't matter. It would be advisable to use a small tuba for an EEflat audition and a large tuba for a BBflat audition, though that is just my opinion.

Side note: I have personally played in a competition in the UK on a CC tuba and it didn't seem to matter. It may vary from competition to competition though.

Timswisstuba wrote:I was tired of having to ask to explain to people why my bell pointed In the other direction so I just made a top action CC. Now everyone is happy.

TubaTinker wrote:I've run into a few 'snots' in the brass band World who consider anything other than Eb and BBb tubas AND treble clef music for trombones, euphoniums, and tubas absolute blasphemy!

It's my contention that it just doesn't make any difference from 'behind the curtain'.

Except that nearly all BB parts are in treble clef. So if you can't read it or can't transpose you are in trouble.

Since I live in this arena I will weigh in. I find life is generally easier if the players use Eb and BBb. I have encountered great players who can play the part well on either a CC or F. I prefer a small horn (F) for the Eb and CC or BBb for the big horn. As long as the player is competent. The key is irrelevant. What is a necessity is how a player understands his/her role within the section. The principle Eb player needs to be a leader and have great facility in the upper register, while the low or (2nd) BBb player is literally a "wind machine." Where the 1st Eb part is about skill and soloistic quality, the 2nd BBb must be a marathon runner in terms of endurance. The inner parts support the outside with the concept of 2nd Eb being the inner partial and middle note to the chords and must be adept to hearing themselves "fit" into the larger picture. The 1st BBb takes most of the solos for Bb Bass and must be the most solid with pitch as the whole section builds around his tonal center. This way each member has a job and prevents excessive octave dropping and doubling of parts, with each member having an essential role.