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Well this has been a very diverse issue as of late. There is the Besson 983, Meinl Weston 2141, as well as the Willson Eb. I'm pretty sure the 983 and 2141 are comparable in price while the Willson is more expensive. That said the difference in the 983 and 2141 are size, the 2141 is a larger Eb flat tuba more suitable for lareger ensembles while the 983 is a stellar all around horn and solo horn but can get lost in huge ensembles if the player isn't supporting the air flow as much as possible. I also know Pat Sheridan helped to design the 983 for what thats worth. A lot of people will tell you a lot of different opinions but from what I've seen more and more people are looking for 983s than ever.

The Gronitz deserves a mention, too. Nice axe!



Welcom back to playing, Dave!

KevinBock wrote:A lot of people will tell you a lot of different opinions but from what I've seen more and more people are looking for 983s than ever.

In short, I would have to second this notion. The 983's really do rock! It is extremely versitile, and I have used with light orchestral, concert band, brass band, quintet, as well as solo literature. Here are my reasons behind my opinion:

I have done a lot of research on Eb horns, and I have also tried all of the models in question. I wanted to find an Eb tuba to supplement my 6/4 VMI Neptune, but I also wanted to use it with many types of ensembles so I would have more options for a given piece.

The tuning for a lot of Eb tubas, although much better than F, can still be awkward at times, depending on the layout of the tuba. The Compensating system is really the way to go. It eliminates a lot of the inconsistencies, and allows you to just focus on fine tuning and intonation. However, some great sounding horns (with Besson in particular) like the BE 981/982 tend to have a 1st valve problem, like a lot of different pitched tubas. But with the 3 + 1 setup, pulling down on a tuning slide is a lot more difficult than pulling up on a front action tuba, where it is more of a flick of the wrist! This was an important consideration for me to switch from my 982 to 983.

Don't forget that the 983 comes with a hard molded case which, when bubble-wrapped inside, is perfect for airline transport. The horn is in a good price range, and it is one of the best "off the shelf" tubas made.

Take my opinions for what they are worth... it is just what worked out best for me.

Regards,

I agree the besson is a tremendous horn..... but if you like rotary valves I think the Miraphone deserves a mention. especially if you have heard Oystein Baadsvik play. The way he sings on his horn (Norwegian Star?) is incredible.

Dave Dorrough wrote:I am considering getting back into playing again after a long absence. My last gig was with the Va. Symphony for 11 years. I am looking for a really good solo horn and I'm partial to the Eflats. Things have changed alot I see since 1988. Just a ton of new models that I haven't played. Any advice would be appreciated. Dave Dorrough

The Besson 983 seems to be the solo-Eb-du-jour these days.

And if you want something that can do symphony duty and sound like a small CC when necessary, the Willson 3400 seems to be the standard against which others are measured.

If you prefer rotary valves, look into the Miraphone 181 Eb (or, if they are yet available, the model based on the Norwegian Star that Baadsvik is playing--though the fact that he plays it so well has the same significance in my mind as the fact that Sheridan plays the 983).

Rick "thinking Eb's are like BBb's--good choices are available but not an overwhelming selection of them" Denney

One quick thing I have forgot to mention which is definitely an important note, the Besson 983's have been one of the most consistent horns that have been mass produced ever. Yes I will definitely show a bias since both my teachers, Pat and Sam, use them and I have played my brother's 983 on many occasions. Its definitely going to be a tough decision to make and one that will take you at least a few months to test many different professional Eb's and I wish you good luck and strongly recommend testing the 983's right away because you'll see that they are simply amazing horns.

All anyone can do is give you some pointers about which ones to try. I owned a 983 and while it was okay, I liked the Willson better as an all-around instrument. Some folks think that the broader sound of the 981 is superior to the 983.

And there's the whole list of other candidates mentioned.

One thing I'm wondering about is given that TMG is introducing a non-compensating high-end 4p+1r BBb, if Walter Nirschl may resurrect his old Eb design. There apparently were never very many of them, but I've been led to understand that the one that Custom had was pretty amazing.

I have a Besson 983 and really enjoy the way it plays and the sound. That said, the Willson 3400 seems to be able to produce more sound than the Besson, although at a higher price. I would agree that the M-W 2141 and Besson 983 are very similar horns, although I prefer the Besson sound, and find the compensating valves more convenient than a 5 valve horn.

The Miraphones 181 Eb doesn't have the breadth of sound that the others do, but could work well for solo for small ensemble work, as long as you like rotary valves. Others have found the low range on the Miraphone to be stuffy, but I was surprised at how easily the low range spoke on the couple that I tried.

The Gronitz would be worth considering, but you are likely to have a hard time finding one in the US. Another consideration is the York Monster Eb with Getzen valves at Baltimore Brass.

Anybody ever play the five rotor version of the MW EEb? I think the four rotor version is an amazing instrument, but I couldn't play well enough in tune in the low register.

***

Willson, hands down. Great for solo work, great in ensembles, large and small. Pretty expensive, but not unusually so. Very heavy, great sound...you'll love it! I do!

Will Hirsbrunner ever make an EEb???

Hirsbrunner does make an EEb. In fact they have more than one model. And if you buy Oystein Baadsvik's new solo CD Tuba Carnival it was recorded with him playing a Hirsbrunner rotary EEb (at least that is what the CD Insert says)

Uncle Buck wrote:Will Hirsbrunner ever make an EEb???

Up until he started playing the new Mirafone EEb 2 years ago, that is what Baadevik played--Hirsbrunner.

Hi Dave --
Welcome back, guy!
I assume you're looking for an all purpose Eb, so here are some random thoughts:

I briefly owned a Besson 983 a while back and it really didn't work out (too small I guess) and was happy to sell it.

I have heard many good things about the new Miraphone
rotary valve horn, but have never seen one.

If possible, you should take a listen to Marty Erickson's
CDs -- MY VERY GOOD FRIEND (jazz, tuba and piano)
and/or MILLENNIUM BRASS (brass quintet). Marty uses
the Willson Eb for everything these days and of course
sounds terrific. If you like what you hear, the Willson
(although a little pricey) might be just what you are
looking for.

Best wishes

Tim Loehr