Advice on switching to CC tuba

[fairweathertuba]

A piggy is much more of a niche tuba than a 186 or a Rudy Meinl 3/4. For an all around tuba I would not recommend anyone buy one. Prokofiev on a piggy? Not so cool. Mahler on a piggy? Same. Piggy is not all around as much as much as a bunch of better choices.

Sorry, I'v probably gotten offtrack here. Still for the long haul a really versatile CC is going to get someone into more and better playing positions than even the best, easiest playing BBb tuba in the world. Texas may very well have special needs, perhaps a $16,00, 6/4 Miraphone in BBb is necessary for even regional band, in which case I would advocate leaving the state entirely, purely for sanity reasons.

[fairweathertuba]

Well, I'm not particularly stuck on a Rudolf Meinl paradigm and am definitely not stuck on a Cerveny one either. I've never seen a piggy played live at an orchestral concert and would maybe change my mind if someone were able to play perhaps a stunning concert with one on Prokofiev V and I were there to hear how it sounded. There may be better choices definitely, but if given a choice between a piggy and a Rudolf Meinl, would definitely have to go with the Meinl. The Meinl is going to come with 5 valves and will have a reachable a pull-able first valve slide, a couple of things a piggy doesn't have. As for the tone, there is no comparison it's only my opinion and of course you are free to use whatever advertising material you wish to back you up but a Meinl usually has a core to the sound that is distinct and projects in a way that most other instruments (including piggies) do not.

Wait, maybe you can reach the piggy first valve slide, I can't remember exactly the ergonomics.

[fairweathertuba]

Well yeah, I remember the ad copy pretty well too. Definitely a Rudy Meinl advertisement. I remember taking the ad home from school and looking at it every day for practically two years.

What to audition on for Texas all state? Well, really I don't know. What to play on and be listenable to in an actual ensemble, I do have some ideas

[Sandlapper]

I think I read somewhere that William Bell win an audition to a major symphony with an Eb sousaphone? After reading all of this post, I wonder how many folks who recommended switching to CC play that as their primary horn. We human beings have an amazing capacity to think that what we are most comfortable with is normal.

Wasn't part of the argument for switching to CC that it was easier to play with strings (less complicated fingering in sharp keys of orchestral music) than with a BB. Is it easier to play CC with the keys band music is written in, i.e., such as in a community concert band or British Style Brass Band? Perhaps someone who is equally at home with BB and CC could comment on this.

If you love music, there are so many opportunities to play not that were not available 40 years ago, and if you don't end up in an symphony that can offer you a salary to support yourself, where is it that where you are going to have the most opportunity to play? I think that a real issue with many of us struggled with when we were in the transition from high school to college is that we are invested in the ideal of what we want to accomplish - be the world's best tuba player, rocket scientist, author of numerous best selling novels.

Two of the best tuba players I have met in South Carolina are a scientist and a computer expert (who I believe got a performance degree). A third excellent tuba player makes his living running an instrument repair business. Another young man who just graduated from college works in a dental lab. A friend who worked for a major national company for years use to joke about all the plant foremen and supervisors who had PhDs in philosophy or poetry.

For years my wife was an administrator in a school district and with new teachers ( think music ed. if that is the route you choose ) it took about three years to see if the new teachers enjoyed teaching enough to stay for a lifetime career. Most folks who didn't like teaching left within the first three years of beginning teaching.

Revisit Big Ben's comments. Give some thought to what your plan A is going to be and what your plan B is going to be. What do you do to support the rest of your life. Even the military bands have down sized. Remember that if you don't have food, clothing and shelter, its awfully hard to work on being the best tuba player there is.

Richard Nelson Bolles' book, "What Color is Your Parachute?" has some useful information on researching careers, interviewing people to find out what they like about their job and researching careers. Bolles revised that book yearly based on feedback from readers and I believe that it has continued to be revised by a colleague, so the most recent edition would probably be the most useful. Perhaps this maybe helpful to you in thinking a bit more out of the box of where the question is BB or CC. It may be helpful to explore some other issues as well.

Best of luck to you in all your future endeavors.

[Jess Haney]

Look guys, Danny said he wants to do a MUSIC EDUCATION degree... how many educators (that are tuba players) teach students at the high school or lower level on CC tuba?

He's not going for a performance degree, so I fail to see how any of your responses are helpful. His focus should be on learning the primary school instruments so he can pick up a flute or clarinet and play it, or mash the tune out on the piano. Picking up lessons on piano and maybe buy a couple of "student" horns is far more preferable to laying down serious cash on a CC tuba (because what college professor isn't going to scoff at a Chinese-clone).

I agree. I have done my entire life on a BBb as my primary mostly due to being a brass bandsman. But I feel that waiting til college is great advice and see what your teacher thinks. I have met a lot of college tuba professors that could care less about the key. The only professors that care about CC over BBb that I have met were not even tuba players and were basing their decision based on what their colleagues played in the orchestra when they were in college. CC may have been industry standard for pro horns 10-20 years ago but now most companies offer BBbs at the same quality and design as their top of the line CCs. Just my observation FWIW

[Uncle Markie]

No employer - and I've had quite few of them - I have worked in the music business as ever asked me what key my tuba was built in.

You seem to be doing quite well performing on the BBb - keep striving to be a fine musician who happens to play the tuba.

Assuming you start a career in Music Education - your students will be playing Bb cornets/trumpets, Bb trombones, baritones, euphoniums and sousaphones, and for the most part Bb horns.

College costs a lot - and by a lot I mean more than you are probably imagining at this time. You'll need books, lodging and you'll want to eat once in a while. One good BBb tuba should suffice. If you are music ed major you've got lots to worry about learning besides orchestral excerpts. Work on your piano/keyboard skills and pay attention in string and woodwind methods classes.

Avoid paying too much attention to sweeping generalities espoused by high school band directors.

Good luck!

Mark Heter

[TubaDanny43]

I agree about the versatility of a 3/4 CC, I have owned a piggy for almost 19 years now.

But... If he's auditioning for state, auditioning for college scholarships, and auditioning for placement into college wind ensembles, He really needs a horn that delivers a lush, thick, knock-your-socks-off tone. He's going to be trying out against others with 1291's, thors, pt-6's, ect. Yes, even at the high school level in Texas.

He still ever answered my question (asked twice in two different threads) about which horn he currently plays. If it's not a major upgrade, there's no reason to change to a CC

Very sorry for not replying to your question. (Haven't had much time to read over my responses). At the moment I am playing a BBb St. Petersburg tuba (school owned). Two years ago it was dropped by a senior who just graduated, on its rotors which now the 3rd and 4th are bent and the 4th rotor makes a pretty noticeable "clinging" sound. My school does have other tubas but this is the only one that everything moves on and has a case.

[Leto Cruise]

I would advise you to purchase a 6/4 CC tuba right away since those are the horns winning jobs. It's your best bet in this economy.

[TubaDanny43]

I agree about the versatility of a 3/4 CC, I have owned a piggy for almost 19 years now.

But... If he's auditioning for state, auditioning for college scholarships, and auditioning for placement into college wind ensembles, He really needs a horn that delivers a lush, thick, knock-your-socks-off tone. He's going to be trying out against others with 1291's, thors, pt-6's, ect. Yes, even at the high school level in Texas.

He still ever answered my question (asked twice in two different threads) about which horn he currently plays. If it's not a major upgrade, there's no reason to change to a CC

Very sorry for not replying to your question. (Haven't had much time to read over my responses). At the moment I am playing a BBb St. Petersburg tuba (school owned). Two years ago it was dropped by a senior who just graduated, on its rotors which now the 3rd and 4th are bent and the 4th rotor makes a pretty noticeable "clinging" sound. My school does have other tubas but this is the only one that everything moves on and has a case.

So you're playing on a damaged tuba? Why not have them repair it?

The way I described above is actually the way it came back from the repair shop. I don't know how it was before it was it was sent off.

[bill]

Interesting that no one has yet suggested that eventually you will have to master a bass tuba as well as a contra bass tuba. So, here you are worrying about CC vs. BBb and no one mentions F or Eb. I think Lee Stofer has it right and I have played beside Lee, on Eb, and he is a terrific Eb player but plays everything very well. I was also playing in an Orchestra once upon a time, hired specifically to play Arnold's 5 Cornish Dances, which has two lovely tuba solos in it. During sectionals, I was asked to play both solos and complemented, afterward, on how well they sounded. The instructor was the low brass instructor for a local college. He asked me what sort of CC I was playing and I told him it was a Willson 3400s Eb. He was astounded; he was certain I had been playing a CC. I played it on Eb because I believe it was written for that horn, not a CC or BBb (both of which I can play, as well as F). We see and hear what we want to see and hear and, unless there is a compelling reason for a certain horn, play what works best for you and the composer.

[eupher61]

If you want to switch to CC, go for it. It's a blast.

So is playing BBb. Or F or Eb.

You're playing Tuba. There are several instruments involved. If you want to pursue tuba performance at all, your best bet is to eventually learn to play all 4 keys, plus euphonium, at a level where you can sight read on all, play anything on all of them (literally anything, no matter what the "composer's intent"), with the confidence like you've played each all of your life.

As a teacher, nothing, no one, should tell you to not be the best musician you can be. If that means you take tuba lessons to the point of a performance major, so be it. What that simply does not mean is that you absolutely have to learn to play CC tuba, or F or Eb. There are plenty of arguments on each side of learning multiple key tubas as an undergrad...what it depends on is you. Your ability, your interest, your dedication. Some of it may depend on what instruments are available to you as well...but by no means should you feel obligated to buy a CC tuba "because you have to in order to be a tuba player." There is plenty to learn musically playing a BBb tuba. Literature can be problematic, getting to specific pieces. But advance to your highest level on BBb, and do all you can to be the best musician overall that you can be. That will help you be the best teacher you can be.

[TubaDanny43]

Thank you all very much ya'lls advice! I will be able to go back to TMEA this year so I plan on trying out some BBb and CC tubas.

[swillafew]

An acquaintance of mine has a collection of good horns, and his Kanstul Eb really got my attention. If I was starting from scratch I would want to try one early.

[Mark]

Rather than advice, I have a request. If you do not want to be a teacher, please do not get a Music Education degree.

I have seen way too many kids driven away from music because their band/orchestra director "settled" for a teaching job rather than what they really wanted to do.