False tone pitch options

[Donn]

Quite a ways back in a discussion here, I was surprised to find that there wasn't full consensus over the pitches in the false tone range. I belong to the "5th" school of thought that finds the open false tone note at Eb, on a Bb tuba - a 5th below the 2nd partial, but it turns out that there's a small but distinguished "4th" school that would put it at F.

I don't believe I am ready to abandon that position, but recently while practicing a piece that bounces down to E every once in a while, and it kind of hurries along and you have to play loud and punchy, kind of by accident I discovered that I could get acceptably close to that E, basically setting the valves for a false tone D and just playing E instead rather forcefully. It's a hair flat, but acceptable in this context, and it comes through much clearer than the 3 valve E. I'll experiment further, but it seemed to work better than the open Eb fingering, which tends to be kind of vague on pitch.

So I guess my position is now more like "false tone is a 5th below the 2nd partial, or whatever's convenient."

[Donn]

As it happens, this was a Conn 40K (I'm practicing 3 valves, for a loaner sousaphone coming up.) I wouldn't be surprised if the 14K are 36K are better.

The way it seems to me, if you look for the natural pitch, it's more or less a 5th below the 2nd partial.

But, encouraged by the few who subscribe to the 4th principle to give it a try, it seemed like when I force the pitch up a step from where it wants to be, the tone is a little heartier or less flabby. It takes a determined effort to make it work, though, and quite a shift from the adjacent low 2nd partial notes. And the advantage diminishes as you go down into the low part of the false tone range - it's like the false tones actually benefit from the straight valve tubing, clearer and more stable than they are on the open horn.

[ken k]

I agree bloke. My Pan American helicon which is very similar to the 14K has a very usable false tone register. I play low Eb open, D second, etc....

We often play St. James Infirmary in the Hot 3 and I start the tune on the low false tone D and play it down there for the first time through, then take it up in the "normal" register. lots of fun and the audience always gets a kick out of hearing it so low.

My old Beuscher "Dr. Seussaphone" has a good false tone register as well, same tuning. At least that is what I use. I imagine you could lip it to any pitch you want within reason.

k

False tones are very flexible on many tubas.

The very best BBb tuba for "false tones" (stability-wise...with 0/1/2/12/23/playing all of the half-steps right where the player needs them to be) is the Conn 14K/36K sousaphone.

GP likes to use them when playing the CSO York tuba. I played it one time for a few minutes. It's very resonant (and, after an overhaul or two, very thinwall, which increases resonance even more), and false tones work nearly as well on that tuba as they do on those Conn BBb sousaphones. Additionally, GP is just a friggin monster. Most other tubas' false tones don't measure up to the false-tone pitch stability offered with the Conn large-4/4 (5/4...??) sousaphones.

[MrHidan30]

There is one orchestral excerpt in particular where a "false tone" low E natural would help tremendously.

I'm probably the only one who wouldn't know this. What excerpt are you refering to?

[pwhitaker]

My 6/4 3 valve BBb Holton with its 24" recording bell has solid false tones down to the pedal A which is 1-2-3 as a false tone. The 1-3 Bb can be played more "lyrically" than the pedal Bb. Additionally most of the false tones can be bent up or down a half to whole pitch rather easily. This does not appear to be dependent on mouthpiece selection - I use very shallow (LOUD 12, Hauser Tommy Johnson) to very deep (LOUD LM3, Reynolds Dr. Young, Bloke Grand Orchestral with spacer) and get the same effect regardless of cup depth, rim diameter or backbore (which the Dr. Young lacks). The Miraphone 186 Bb seems to like just the 3rd valve false tone for the low B.

[vapourboy]

There is one orchestral excerpt in particular where a "false tone" low E natural would help tremendously.

I'm probably the only one who wouldn't know this. What excerpt are you refering to?

I'm suspecting it's Respighi's Fountains. May be wrong, I'd personally be hesitant to sustain that privileged E.

[iiipopes]

As with everything else, and with all the anecdotes posted above, the best answer is, "It depends on the horn." A Besson 3-valve comp I used to own had almost non-existant false tones, and those that would intonate were wildly out of tune. A 38K I played once had absolutely perfect false tones. Open false Eb down to pedal BBb had no difference in tone than conventional range, and were absolutely spot on with intonation. Other sousaphones I have played had the intonation, but gravelly tone. I don't even try with my 186, just pull. E nat is good 2+4 with a little lipping, Eb is 1+4 pull, etc., grabbing various handfulls of valves and pulls on the way down as may be expected.

Since I am a band player and not an orchestra player, I have only occasional, if any, call for the near-pedal range, although I will occasionally drop a cadential note or so. (Warning - peeve follows) I have played in band with guys who thought they always had to play everything down the octave, destroying clarity and articulation of the section.

So, again, it depends....