playing in tune with a jupiter 482

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:57 am

hi from france,

I play a jupiter 482 (sylver model) and would like to know if someone has tested this instrument.

with the 24AW mouthpiece they sold to me I play very high, not in Bb but more in B.

if I try to tune it, the tuning slide is so out, it can fall...

is this a human problem ?

many thanks for your help,

ray

sailn2ba · Post by **sailn2ba** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:33 am

You can lower the pitch somewhat with "tuning bits" - extensions that insert between the mouthpiece and the receiver. They are frequently used on sousaphones. More than 2 of them gets uncomfortable because the horn is further away from your face.
You might also try a different mouthpiece. . . Bach 18 or Helleberg?
Let us know what happens.

ppalan · Post by **ppalan** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:52 am

You've probably already thought of this but is it possible that you need a Euro shank mouthpiece. Perhaps the 24AW is an American shank or even smaller.
Pete

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:29 am

many thanks for you answers,

do you mean I need a longer mouthpiece ? do you have any idea of a model to solve my problem ?

the jupiter 24aw is about :
- 10 cm long (7,3 cm is outside when connected to the tuba)
- the diameter is 3,2 cm (inside the circle)

moreover, I prefer to play in 440 Hz

ray

eupho · Post by **eupho** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:42 am

I have no personal experience with the Jupiter horns but there have been several postings here about their intonation issues. Is this a horn you bought or is it a school horn? If you bought it take or send it back to the dealer with explanation of the problem. They should refund your money.

I doubt that a mouthpiece change or bits is worth the results.

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:51 am

I bought it a few month ago,
sure the dealer won't listen to my demand...
that's like that in France

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:54 am

These tubas work best with a deep mouthpiece, but are not of a quality or resonance to warrant spending a lot on a mouthpiece. A Conn Helleberg 120, or reasonable lesser expensive facsimile thereof, usually gets the best out of these small-bore 3/4 horns, including Jupiter, Yamaha 1&2 series, King 1140, etc. Something like a Schilke HII also works well, but I wouldn't spend the extra money unless you can really tell a difference.

I would see if they would trade you the 24AW (which is usually supplied for a beginner) for another mouthpiece.

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:02 am

I have phone to the dealer, he said to me to call Jupiter's show room...
who said to me to call the distributor...
who said to me this tuba is made like the others 482, same dimensions...

so it might be a regular problem for every people who play this instrument with the original mouthpiece

need to find a good solution, cause it's not cheap at all

regards

eupho · Post by **eupho** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:48 am

What instrument were you playing prior to the Jupiter? Some times it takes a while to adjust to a new instrument. Has anyone else test played your tuba? If they have similar problems then take the horn and a tuner back to the dealer and demonstrate the problem. Do you know anyone else who plays the same model? It would be worth seeing how your horn works for them and how theirs works for you. ( check the calibration on your tuner as well)

rayaseplacbe wrote:I have phone to the dealer, he said to me to call Jupiter's show room...
who said to me to call the distributor...
who said to me this tuba is made like the others 482, same dimensions...

so it might be a regular problem for every people who play this instrument with the original mouthpiece

need to find a good solution, cause it's not cheap at all

regards

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:09 am

At the beginning I was playing an old euphonium, I have also a yamaha Cornet, no pitch problem...

Unfortunatly, i don't know anyone to compare the instrument, that was my demand to Jupiter's show room, to make a comparison with the instrument they sell, no rendez-vous...

I was hopping to get more information, I found one similar thread on this forum, but no end...

Moreover the 24AW I play is really hard for centering the sound. It's difficult for me to imagine playing a bigger mouthpiece, but I need something longer, does it exist ?

eupho · Post by **eupho** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:35 am

So you weren't playing tuba before you bought the Jupiter? That may be the issue. Your embouchure is used to being tighter than it needs to be. Try doing a lot of buzzing on the mouthpiece for several days without the instrument. Think about relaxing the muscles and extending the buzz lower. When you have accomplished that go back to the tuba and see if things have improved.

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:42 am

I did that every day since december, so I might be ready to play this instrument in tune.

But I will still working without the tuba, a mouthpiece in a plastic tube... it's more in tune !

eupho · Post by **eupho** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:13 pm

OK, Pick a midrange pitch like F. Buzz it on the mouthpiece and lock it in on the tuner. Then buzz the pitch and gradually insert the mouthpice(as you buzz) into the tuba and see how the pitch is.
Try the same procedure on several notes.

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:21 pm

I tried again,
I get the same note in the tuba, but it's difficult to stay on it plugging the mouthpiece, looking at the tuner...

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:40 pm

almost the same note, for natural notes only.
too hard to carry the tuba, moving fingers on buttons when putting the mouthpiece in place for other notes.
but the tuba is getting more high, I am a little bit tired

eupho · Post by **eupho** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:31 pm

If you are getting the correct pitch on the tuba you are headed in the right direction. The buzz will waver some as you put the mouthpiece in the tuba but should lock in once it is in all the way. Do what you need to do to rest.

ASmith · Post by **ASmith** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:48 am

Hi,
I played a 482 with a quartet for a good while. While these horns are small they have a big sound. I used a Perantucci PT-88 and never had many troubles, besides the A natural. I would suggest using a buzz enhancer or just buzzing on the mouthpiece with a tone generator or a piano just to practice matching pitch. The 24AW is a good mouthpiece, but I think for this horn it is a little small. If Jupiter is as consistent as they used to be, then you have a good little horn.

MikeMason · Post by **MikeMason** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 11:19 am

It's not the horn. Unless you have a significant repair issue or something stuck in the horn.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:40 pm

Both the PT88 and the PT50, as I discussed above, are deep funnels.

rayaseplacbe · Post by **rayaseplacbe** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:24 pm

Do you mean it's a bigger mouthpiece than a 24AW, in term of volume ? I am looking for something longer to get a lower sound.

I like the shape of the 24AW, the roundness of the rim.

But I would prefer something easier to center the sound, the throat is so big.

On a web site I found that effect concerning Mouthpiece Anatomy

Backbore :

Combinations of size and shape make the tone darker or brighter, raise or lower the pitch in one or more registers, increase or decrease volume. The backbore's effects depends in part also on the throat and cup.

TubeNet

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