TubeNet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMQXqMQkUYo" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

Cerveny CxB-x83 (Arion) or something else?

This video was taken in Prague, so I think there's about 100% chance it's Cerveny (or maybe Amati).

58mark wrote:good question. from the finish I would guess it was old, but it doesn't have the traditional old style cerveny spatulas on it.

Of course the lacquer coul have been removed or maybe even ordered without it.

either way, fun link.. thanks for sharing

It isn't very old unless the linkages were replaced (assuming it's Cerveny). Recent Cerveny tubas have similar spatulas, coil springs and miniball linkages. I believe Cervenys have always been available in raw brass.

bort wrote:This video was taken in Prague, so I think there's about 100% chance it's Cerveny (or maybe Amati).

That's what I thought - Amati rotary tubas are and have always been Cerveny tubas. There is an Amati "Arion" that Amati USA (Ari) says should be called a Cerveny CBB-483 (http://www.cerveny.co.at/tuben/bbb_tuben/abb_483_4m.php" target="_blank" target="_blank). There are also several higher grades (683, 783, etc) with the Cerveny name.

These look like ideal horns to me, I'd love to be able to try one.

6XX and up are called Cerveny.

5XX and down are called Amati.

Same main bugle. Differences are in materials (more or less of nickel silver and/or red brass) plus in the finishes and in the number of valves. I don't think Amati used to come lacquered in Czechoslovakia.

Klaus

BTW. I think the bell is too narrow for a piggy. Could it be a Lidl?

Klaus

imperialbari wrote:BTW. I think the bell is too narrow for a piggy. Could it be a Lidl?

Klaus

Piggys are *03 = bigger bore, etc. I think that the *93 series is closer to the Piggy.

http://www.cerveny.co.at/tuben/bbb_tuben/cbb793_4mr.php

The *83's generally have smaller bells

Aren't Piggy and Arion two names for the same concept coming in CC and in BBb?

K

imperialbari wrote:Aren't Piggy and Arion two names for the same concept coming in CC and in BBb?

K

Close - but Piggy's bore is larger - 21.2mm vs 20.2mm for the *83 series and there are BBb and CC in both series (although the *03 in BBb may not actually exist beyond a prototype or so?). And I'm not much up on Lidl - did they build similar instruments? It seems that most Euro tubas were modeled after Cerveny designs.

While Lee Stofer was in GA, he imported small Lidl tubas. Maybe still does.

K

imperialbari wrote:BTW. I think the bell is too narrow for a piggy. Could it be a Lidl?

Klaus

I've got a modern era Lidl and that horn in the video does not resemble it at all. The easiest sign is the Lidl has a vertical main tuning slide but there are several other differences. Current Eb F C BBb Lidl's share the same design which has been around for awhile. I can't speak to really old Lidl's however.