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Does anybody know anything about Keifer tubas? Evidently from Williamsport, PA. Any info on manufacture, era, quality, etc. would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Brua C. Keefer (not Keifer) was the factory foreman for the Henry Distin Manufacturing Company in Williamsport, PA from the 1880s, when Henry Distin first opened the factory, until 1909, when Distin died. Keefer's family bought the company from Distin's estate and renamed it the Brua C. Keefer manufacturing company.

In the early part of their existence Keefer made high quality brass instruments that were the same as the Williamsport Distins in all but name. I think that Keefer had more to do with the high quality reputation of the Williamsport Distins anyway. By that time an older Henry Distin was more hands off.

By the late 1920s Brua's son, Brua Keefer, Jr. had taken over the company. He expanded the company and started making more student line instruments, which they continued to do until a fire closed the factory and the company for good in about 1940.

Williamsport Distin cornets were among the best playing cornets ever made. The early Keefers were just as good. They weren't as well known for their low brass, but the Distin and Keefer tubas that I have owned have all been very good players, once they were put into playing shape. Almost every horn I have found from that era needs a valve job, but once that is done they are great.

bloke wrote:I have very limited exposure to these, but a 3V top-action Eb that was offered to me quite a few years ago (' didn't buy it, though inexpensive) had a beautiful sound and played very well in tune *with itself.

*well below A=440

Is it possible to correct this and bring the instrument up to today's A=440 standard?

Thanks.

bloke wrote:

Is it possible to correct this and bring the instrument up to today's A=440 standard?

no prob.

Ok, that was good!

But seriously, will the integrity of the instrument be maintained if the instrument is cut? Will it continue to play in tune throughout its range? Or is the only way to evaluate this is to cut the horn and then experiment and keep adjusting. I am looking for a low priced EEb to learn on. Maybe I should just buy the Amati on Dan Oberloh's site as I assume that it is (relatively) in tune. Perhaps that is better than trying to modernize a vintage horn.

Thanks

If a horn is in old style "low pitch," meaning A at about 432, cutting the main slide, if there is enough length to do so, doesn't usually have an impact on the overall intonation tendencies. Equivocal enough for you?

Seriously, I have an 1890s vintage Distin BBb tuba on which the main slide was cut over an inch to bring it in tune. It remained in tune with itself, and is probably one of the best playing tubas I have ever owned. This doesn't mean that this would be the case for every horn. OTOH, the Keefer which you mention may not need this depending on the vintage. If it is a later one the standard would have already been set at A=440 and it could be fine.

If you are thinking of the one that's on ebay, call Ed Strege at Badger State Musical Instrument Repair, they're in the yellow pages in Elkhorn, Wi. He is the seller of that horn, and should be able to tell you if it is in low pitch and if it needs a valve job.

I have a Conn double-belled baitone (yes- not euphonium) that was made in 1907. It had the usual Conn low pitch double "S" slides as the main tuning slides. I had new normal-shaped tuning slides made for it, and now (pulled out a little) it plays fine up to A440. You may be able to do something similar (replace, not hack). The early Keefer horns are continuations of the Distin models, and speaking for the ones I've played, are worth it.

Will it continue to play in tune throughout its range? Or is the only way to evaluate this is to cut the horn and then experiment and keep adjusting.

If it's low pitch, it does NOT play "in tune" NOW, at least not "in tune" with anybody else. IMHO, it is therefore unuseable without being shortened to A=440.

I would consider it worthless as a musical instrument (maybe of value to a collector) unless it plays up to pitch, therefore I would not bother yourself worrying about messing it up, just have it cut.


--Christian

Conn (and others) often made conversions of high-pitch instruments to low by providing a LENGTHENED tuning slide to be used when playing with a band using "low pitch". When one used these tuning slides, one would have to pull each valve slide out slightly to compensate.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... otohosting

This horn has THAT kind of tuning slide. I am merely suggesting that by using a normal style "U" slide, that one may be able to return the instrument to it's normal pitch. Both "high" and "low" pitch were used around the turn of the century until A440 became standard, and makers had to accomodate this.

windshieldbug wrote:Conn (and others) often made conversions of high-pitch instruments to low by providing a LENGTHENED tuning slide to be used when playing with a band using "low pitch". When one used these tuning slides, one would have to pull each valve slide out slightly to compensate.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... otohosting

This horn has THAT kind of tuning slide. I am merely suggesting that by using a normal style "U" slide, that one may be able to return the instrument to it's normal pitch. Both "high" and "low" pitch were used around the turn of the century until A440 became standard, and makers had to accomodate this.

Michael, I'm not sure I follow you. Back in the bad old days before about 1930, there were two band pitch standards, true, but high pitch was about A=457 (very high) and low pitch which was A=435 (about 20 cents low). Even if you had one of the combination tuning slides, you''d still need to do some work to get an A440 out of the horn. The 435 pitch was sometimes called "international standard' pitch.

The horn in question, however, doesn't have the double slide:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW

The best thing to do would be to email Ed Strege and ask him. Looks like a sweet little Eb, but I don't know if most would consider a top-action 3-banger to be worth the $500 asking price.



..or am I missing something?