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The standard instrumentation for which British Brass Band music is written consists of 25 brass players, plus percussion.

1 x Eb Soprano Cornet
9 x Bb Cornets
1 x Flugel horn
3 x Eb Alto horn
2 x Bb Baritone
2 x Euphonium
2 x Tenor Trombones
1 x Bass trombone
2 x Eb Tubas
2 x BBb Tubas

Think you need conductor. I have never seen a brass band without except on the march.

1 x Eb Soprano Cornet - 1 Part
9 x Bb Cornets - 4 Parts (Solo, Repiano, Second and Third)
1 x Flugel horn - 1 Part
3 x Eb Alto horn - 3 Parts (Solo, First and Second)
2 x Bb Baritone - 2 Parts (First and Second)
2 x Euphonium - 1 or 2 parts depending on composer/arranger (Treble Clef)
2 x Tenor Trombones - 2 Parts (First and Second) (Treble Clef)
1 x Bass trombone - 1 Part (Bass Clef)
2 x Eb Tubas - 1 Part (Treble Clef)
2 x BBb Tubas - 1 Part (Treble Clef)

Percussion - As required by music

Neptune wrote:Think you need conductor. I have never seen a brass band without except on the march.

The exception that proves the rule? - do they bring a different repertoire to marches?

In terms of music *every* brass band has a set of hymn books. These are rarely played in public but used as a warm up. They get the band to balance, blend and improve intonation (flatten those major thirds and 7ths! - I think that's what we do, I play BBb bass so mostly I am pumping out the tonic). A set of hymn books would be useful. As a minor issue you may also struggle with BBb bass players reading the treble clef part. After thinking I could learn to transpose to play the parts on a c tuba I gave up and used the bands BBb tuba. So much easier.

I would say you need a conductor. There are too many players to run without one, unless you are only going to play a very limited repertoire or have players with excellent ability. Intonation is a big problem in brass bands, so someone out the front with a good ear really helps.

Most bands have a distinctive uniform but I have noticed after a 20 year hiatus that the bands in Australia are trending to more neutral,casual and cheaper uniforms or just wearing tuxedos.

If you get it started I hope you find brass as rewarding as I do. I spent a long time away from them, playing in orchestras, but have come back to them finding them much more rewarding not only in terms of more notes per hour but also that they place a huge emphasis on musical teamwork and technical ability.

Do it!

bloke wrote:If you're referring to "holding a BBb or Eb tuba, looking at treble clef middle c and g, and playing them 'open' ", there are folks around here that would have no difficulty doing that.

Is that how the "basses" music works, or is it some other way?

You nailed it. Of course, someone with a C tuba could look at those same written notes (if in the BBb part) and play them '1.'

I did the BBb part on a C tuba...I can't imagine it being difficult (after 1-2 rehearsals) for anyone who understands how music is notated. Some brass band people might have preferred/insisted that I use a BBb tuba, but I don't have one Now, though, I can read Bb treble comfortably on the fly

My brass band wasn't particularly 'good' but we did play 'good' music written specifically for the brass band medium. In my experience (certainly not exhaustive), the original music written for brass band had much divisi, sometimes quite extensive/significant, in the tuba parts so that 4 players (2 per part) were necessary. The arrangements of tunes originally for orchestra, etc. rarely had this feature.

Go here, Joe: http://www.nabba.org/

By-the-way... there is absolutely NOTHING written about tuba players having to read treble clef parts! Typically... there are two Eb and two BBb tubas in a brass band but there is nothing in the rules that says those parts cannot be played on CC and F tubas if desired. Having bass clef tuba parts really simplifies getting the job done.

Let the arguments begin!

Miscellany comments:

The solo cornet part very much equals the 1st violin part of the orchestra. It is played by a section of 4 players. I have seen bands with 5 players in that section, cutting the manning of the 3rd cornet section to one player. I also have seen bands with down to one solo cornet. Doesn’t work well as the part is very taxing, physically. A good section knows how to spread the workload between the players.

Using trumpets on the cornet parts will prevent you from experiencing the very idea of a string orchestra made up of brass instruments.

The thrill apparently is about playing the test pieces of the most difficult section (named differently in various countries). These pieces are not in the public domain. Aside of original brass band music by real composers like Vaughan Williams I very much tend towards preferring good transcriptions over the original stuff by lesser minds.

I agree about the benefits of working intensively on hymn type material to get intonation and balance right. I haven’t issued a hymn book per se, but I have about 75 settings that may fill that purpose in a start-up situation.

The traditional British brass band uniforms appear being inspired by the formal regimental mess uniforms of their army. When the Copenhagen Brass Band competed at the first European Championships held at Royal albert Hall in October of 1978 that project already had stretched the fund of each member, so we wore new black turtlenecks and the black trousers that everybody already had.

CC tuba players used to playing F tuba may apply the F fingerings to an imaginary bass clef of the treble clef BBb parts.

Involving the percussion section in the initial studying of new repertory may speed up the learning of the rhythmical aspects. Bands working with the brass alone in that phase tend to be better in tune.

Most good modern cornet players know how to juggle their slides. If only the alto horn players had the same abilities. Baritones, euphoniums, and tubas with compensating valves are a bit easier off.

The main soloists are the principal cornet, the 1st euphonium, and the 1st trombone. There used to be, maybe still are, prizes for the best player within each of these categories at the big competitions. Back around 1875 the euphonium and trombone prizes at a big national competition were won by the same player. The boxed adjudicators hadn’t seen that Black Dyke’s 1st euphonium player after his euph solo had picked up a valve trombone to play the trombone solo of the given test piece. Since then valve trombones have been banned from British brass band competitions.

Klaus

The Brass Band of the Western Reserve is working on a "Frozen" medley. It's actually quite charming. Especially when there's an Eb tuba solo for "Do You Want to Build a Snowman?" I enjoy transcriptions quite a bit, especially when the bass part is originally not tuba, because it's something brand new, and not basically the same thing that was played once before.

Flugelhorn, 3 alto horns, and 2 baritones at their best function as a smooth inner core with functions similar to the orchestral low clarinets, horns, and violas. At their worst they are an out of tune stuffy mess.

Not only the NC brass band (with at least 2 TN members in their tuba section) have employed 3 French horns for the 3 Eb alto horn parts. The homogeneity may suffer, but the projection is boosted. And you may attract more professional players. A photo of a non-competing London based brass band suggest that they also use French horns for the baritone parts. Reading from what horn players would call parts in Bb basso should be familiar to good players.

Starting in a small brass band in 1960 let me experience two different schools of transcriptions. The old style had all players play all the time. Lots of umpah as if the sources had been piano reductions. The cornet melody often doubled in the lower octave by the 1st baritone. The newer style of course also had tuttis, but the texture was much more varied by employing various sections or mixes of sub-sections. A British brass house unloads lots of old style scores on eBay.

Klaus

I know that the River City Brass Band (and its youth counter part) use French Horns instead of tenor horns. British Brass Band purists may not like that, but I think it sounds better myself.

TubaTinker wrote:Go here, Joe: http://www.nabba.org/

By-the-way... there is absolutely NOTHING written about tuba players having to read treble clef parts! Typically... there are two Eb and two BBb tubas in a brass band but there is nothing in the rules that says those parts cannot be played on CC and F tubas if desired. Having bass clef tuba parts really simplifies getting the job done.

Let the arguments begin!

Dan,

Under NABBA rules (unless they've changed this year), any tuba part can be played by a tuba in any key. If you want F tubas on the BBb part or BBb tubas on the Eb part, you can do it. However, the vast majority of British brass band tuba parts are published in treble clef. Some also have bass clef parts included, but they're often marked "Tuba in C", which can get a bit confusing.

I don't believe there's any rule against rewriting the treble clef parts back into concert pitch, either. It's just a matter of someone being willing to make the effort.

bloke wrote:

Neptune wrote:The standard instrumentation is 25 brass players, plus percussion.

1 x Eb Soprano Cornet
9 x Bb Cornets
1 x Flugel horn
3 x Eb Alto horn
2 x Bb Baritone
2 x Euphonium
2 x Tenor Trombones
1 x Bass trombone
2 x Eb Tubas
2 x BBb Tubas

Think you need conductor. I have never seen a brass band without except on the march.

I'm assuming that the trombones (I know this really exposes my ignorance, but so what?) are all *slide* trombones...
...and the conductor thing: "need" = need or "need" = "so traditional that without one it wouldn't be considered a brass band" ?

Thanks very much for the instrumentation list.
11 hoss trumpet players...and all that would *not* have conflicts for get-togethers...
Jonathan, are any of those trumpet parts doubled?
...and (OK...I asked for the instrumentation, but now I'm asking another question...)
How many actual PARTS are traditionally written for (and thanks in advance) the
- Bb Cornets (3 parts...??)
- Eb Alto horns (1 part...??)
- Bb Baritone (1 part...??)
- Euphoniums (1 part...??)
- Tenor Trombones (2 parts...??)
- Eb Tubas (1 part...??)
- BBb Tubas (1 part...??)

bloke "Could 13 brass men actually cover the parts...and how many percussionists, please?"

Hi Joe

For a conclusive answer: some parts are doubled sometimes. Other times they're not.

Often on the 'easier' pieces you'll find lots of doubled parts. On some other charts (usually the harder and more fun ones) the pieces are written very separately (although there are also hard/fun charts with doubled parts). If you want to have a real 'British' Brass Band I'd think you should aim for at least 25 Brass.

For example:
- My Band had to play 'Dove Descending' as the A Grade set work for a competition a few years ago... (here's a youtube recording of the piece that isn't great, but gives an idea...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87QM_caZvv4" target="_blank" target="_blank). It had 9 completely different cornet parts and a heap of other splits. You might be able to re-write stuff like that to play with fewer players, but it'd be a lot of work and you'd lose a fair few effects.
- We also played a piece called 'Vienna Nights' (another 'test' work - another recording: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3C0Cj-hQKI" target="_blank" target="_blank). This had basically two sets of parts - BBb Bass 1 was playing a completely different written part to BBb Bass 2 - and so on for the rest of the band.

If you're looking at competing and/or playing the newer/harder and more fun works written recently for brass band (more likely to be more exciting to your semi-professionals), I'd suggest going with traditional band numbers and instrumentation.

If you're looking at playing more standard pieces (which can still be challenging and fun), and not ever competing, you'll be able to re-arrange existing works for less players. However that might be not quite enough to keep your playing group satisfied.

Hope this helps. I'm doing live a live stream of the Australian National Band championships over Easter. Have a watch and you'll get an idea of repertoire /standards / styles. I might be covering NABBA as well, but that seems far more touch and go at the moment.

Cheers

Tim

PS - cornets are different to trumpets. They sound very different if nothing else.
PPS - trombones have slides.
PPPS - your tuba section will sound better if they're playing on the same type of tubas (compensating V german v whatever else). Brass bands are all about homogenous blending conical sounds (apologies to the trumpets). Can still sound good on a mix of instruments, but harder to blend and balance, and at the end might not sound like a British brass band
PPPPS - there's absolutely nothing wrong with staring up a brass band that has trumpets and french horns and 'non standard' instruments... but I probably wouldn't call it a 'British' brass band.

Parts- Depending on arranger of course, but most recent music will have almost a seperate part for each seat if it's challenging stuff. Even if not too difficult, most bass parts are split either octaves or harmonies at some point, even in "concert" music.

Happy to privately share some scores if you want to look?

Everyone is Bb or Eb treble clef besides Bass Trom, normal Bass Clef.

Would love to see you get something together, and would equally be of any help I can!

We do at least one piece per programme conductorless, and many top bands do too. I think you'd struggle on a lot of the repertoire without a man in the middle though, especially if you wanted to experience the good stuff to play (ie challenging and rewarding).

Actually Joe,

Take a look at this site, there are sample scores of most of the pieces, from concert to competition, by Peter Graham. We're playing "Torchbearer" this weekend in competition...

http://www.gramercymusic.com/

Very interesting link, Andy!

The direct link for the extensive excerpt of the Torchbearer score:

http://www.gramercymusic.com/image/Torchscore.pdf

Andy's link goes to the interesting story behind this piece.

Klaus

The "Hannaford Street Silver Band" is a band of professional musicians in the British format. Obviously not a contest band - contesting bands have to at least pretend to be amateurs.

They have a considerable web presence, Google should find them for you.

Edit: PS
Uniform: Tux
Conductor: Usually the concertmaster, sometimes hire a guest conductor.
Numbers: Regular 25, plus 2 percussion (they also list 24 subs)

I play in a "small" british-style brass band. Every piece in our folder has been specifically arranged for 13 musicians, who play:
• soprano cornet in Eb
• cornet 1
• cornet 2
• cornet 3
• flugelhorn
• solo horn in Eb
• horn 1 in Eb
• horn 2 in Eb
• euphonium
• trombone 1
• trombone 2
• bass trombone
• tuba
(no percussion)

Since the arrangements are done for this band, they are written in the native clef of the instruments, meaning that trombones & tubas play in bass clef.

Although this is not a full brass band, it is very well balanced. I think it would be an excellent instrumentation to use for a new band.

Before I joined the band, it had switched over from French horns to alto horns and everyone tells me that was a big improvement.

Hup

Neptune wrote:
Think you need conductor.

Someone has to mix the G & Ts!!

hup_d_dup wrote:I play in a "small" british-style brass band. Every piece in our folder has been specifically arranged for 13 musicians, who play:
• soprano cornet in Eb
• cornet 1
• cornet 2
• cornet 3
• flugelhorn
• solo horn in Eb
• horn 1 in Eb
• horn 2 in Eb
• euphonium
• trombone 1
• trombone 2
• bass trombone
• tuba
(no percussion)

Since the arrangements are done for this band, they are written in the native clef of the instruments, meaning that trombones & tubas play in bass clef.

Although this is not a full brass band, it is very well balanced. I think it would be an excellent instrumentation to use for a new band.

Before I joined the band, it had switched over from French horns to alto horns and everyone tells me that was a big improvement.

Hup

But for the missing 3rd tenor trombone this line-up is very similar to the distribution of parts within the 14-piece-brass format.

Klaus

The only ones that couldn’t immediately continue from a 14-piece-brass format to a brass band format would be a horn and a tenor trombone. As there always is some fluctuation among players, a brass choir would be a relevant stepping stone towards a brass band.

Klaus