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So I'm in a rock and a hard place, I'm looking to sell my PT-18 and possibly buy just a cheap F, but probably not, honestly because I just never use an F anymore. I think I've played the poor thing 3 times since this past summer. My dream horn is a really nice Holton 345, a CC would definitely be ideal, but the kind of playing I'm doing now I wouldn't mind going back to BBb land. I have a Mack Brass 410 that is a fantastic instrument, but it's no Holton. All I do now is community band, I play once a week, for fun, sometimes I practice at home whenever time allows, but nothing like I used to whenever I was in school.

So i guess what I'm asking is do you think I should sell my soul for a Holton, or just keep what I've got? I mean, I love the Mack Brass, but like I said before, it's not a 345. Just looking to see what people think.

Hi-
Do you need a 6/4 BAT? Have you played a Holton 345 or similar large horn? Can you afford a 6/4 BAT? If the answer is yes to each, buy one. If the answer to one of the questions is no, hold off.....just my thoughts....
Mark

PS. BTW, the 410 Miraclones are great horns that are exceptionally well in tune, play easy, and project more than you would think...

Having just traded for a "make me happy" kind of horn, I agree with that philosophy. Remember, just because a tuba is a great tuba doesn't mean that it's appropriate or that you really want to keep it forever. If it's not what you want, sell it and move on. And if you change your mind again later, you can always go back. It's just a tuba -- they made more.

If you want a BAT, go for it...why not? You are young, and will never be in better shape to use it for mass tuba destruction. Yes, the used market can be slow from time to time, but honestly, money talks. If you needed to get out of a Holton in a hurry, you could undercut the other sale prices and make yours more appealing. Some 345s are crazy expensive (and could certainly be worth their prices), and you could probably still get back most of your purchase price and sell it before the expensive ones.

I bought a BAT and an F last year and have loved both of them. I did because at the time I could afford the move. Also picked up a Cimbasso at the same time and a nice compensating euphonium. I am retired from my day job and have more than enough time to get several hours each day. (something I could never manage when I was jobbing & teaching) I think time is an important factor for when you "chart new territory." (Some horns feel like they are "plug and play" until you actually get into a playing situation and then you find out all the little quirks - so time to get to know the horn is rather important)

I always wanted a BAT, not that I really needed it. I could make plenty of noise with my 4/4 CC, and a somewhat smaller and 40 year old F. But alas, I wanted a change (something newer that didn't make more mechanical noise than the music that I was trying to play) I did my research and made the move. (and ...Yes, I would like to add a 4/4 CC to the mix.) The horns I have suit me very well indeed and they do help to get my musical ideas across because "yes" they suit me, both musically and physically.

I will say this, that having a BAT just to practice on regularly does wonders for your sound, breathing, phrasing articulation etc & etc. Just about every aspect of your playing needs to be magnified and/or exaggerated. Going back to the F or other small horns is a treat as my sound is open to its fullest.

While I have played for 50 years of my adult life, it was still a slow process to understand the concept of playing a BAT. You hear the term "concept".
I knew what to do, but needed to train my body to actually do it without having to think about. Not easy when you have all those years in a different "4/4 concept." I wish I would have gotten the BAT when I was much younger, just so I would have had the enjoyment longer. It is not appropriate for every situation, but when it is, you have the *presence of a volcano and your own center of gravity - LOL.*

I opted for the BMB CC Bat. It is a great horn. No more quirks than any other, and probably fewer than the older 345s. It is also affordable at around 7K.
I've done some customizing to it, but then I would have probably had to do something on whatever horn I got.

If it is something you really want, and can afford it, I say the time to make the move is "NOW" I should have gotten one about 30 years ago but was never in a position to make the move.

Paul "The Bucket List Man - who is tired of waiting for yet another excuse to get what I have always wanted" Maybery

The Mack Brass 410/Mira 186 tubas are run-of-the-mill/dime-a-dozen type tubas. More than enough of 'em out there.

As others have said: buy what makes you happy and what fits your sound concept. If the Holton BATs do that for you, then, there you go

CC 186 - perhaps the most ergonomically comfortable tuba to hold. I love that the upper branch is low enough to comfortably lay the left hand on it for 1st valve adjustment and at the same time accomplish a perfect balance of the instrument. Not many horns are more comfortable.

This will sooner than later become the next 'cannon' in my 'arsenal.' Most likely in a Mack or Wessex in gold brass and without lacquer.

It hasn't been that long that many orchestra auditions were won on the 186 (a practical and secure horn to use when accuracy in an audition is paramount.) Then usually the winner would bring his 'cannon' to the orchestra after he had a signed contract.

I have to agree that it's worth it just to buy the horn that you want and will make you happy. There's not point in wasting your money on something that you won't really use or want to use. You said you mainly play in a concert band, so a big 345 would be right at home there. I know band conductors love having a BAT to hold down the fort while the rest of band blasts away at impacts. I have had many horns over the years, some that I have liked and some that I have loved, and, even though I have lost them all and have completely new horns, they were the ones that really inspired me to play at that time.

So, get what will make you wish you were playing it, and then play it!

Well, to be honest, I LOVE my Mack Brass 410. Thing plays like a freaking dream, but it's just too small. I have to be careful not to overblow, ect. I feel like me being so young a 6/4 would really fit my parameters well, whenever I've played them I've loved playing them, it hasn't been a huffing and puffing contest, so to speak.