TubeNet

The fabled B&S 101 stencils...some say they it's a better Mira 186 at 1/4 the cost, some say you can hear a bit of Alexander coming from its outstandingly tall bell. Some even say B&S made its successors worse in order to not cannibalize their premium lines One thing's for certain, the communist East Germans had no sense of supply and demand so there are thousands of these things out there.

This Musica does not appear to have a 45 degree leadpipe entry into the first valve, although the 45 degree exit from 4th valve and the club-shaped details and the outstandingly tall bell are good signs. It's not like you can trust Musica to not slap their name on any old POS, so a verdict is needed on this Musica. At risk of it being poached if it is the real thing.

http://houston.craigslist.org/msg/4955858046.html

Musica is so common a term in old German songs that it cannot be patented or registered as a trademark.

This tuba apparently has features pointing towards the maker being B&S, but the resolution is too low to tell for sure.

Klaus

TheGoyWonder wrote:The fabled B&S 101 stencils...some say they it's a better Mira 186 at 1/4 the cost, some say you can hear a bit of Alexander coming from its outstandingly tall bell. Some even say B&S made its successors worse in order to not cannibalize their premium lines One thing's for certain, the communist East Germans had no sense of supply and demand so there are thousands of these things out there.

I think that it is pretty miraculous that the Eastern Bloc horns came out as good as they did. Under the Communist system, production goals were quite a bit more important than consistent quality *and* actually making money. Have to keep those production numbers up, up, up! Many of the musical instruments came out fine but other precision things like automobiles and cameras suffered. How can we forget the wonderful Yugo? Somewhat dated but fairly decent design with extremely poor execution. When a real car was $5-6K new, a Yugo was $3.5K! 50% the price and worth it!

Looks like a PT1. I played one at Custom Music; if it's equivalent product, that's a nice horn especially at that price.

You really need to post some better detailed images of the profile of the thumbring, the 'keel', and the bracing. This horn could be of the same genre as the Sanders 'Imperial' that was marketed by Custom Music in the 70's/80's. This horn could be of Chinese origin. That doesn't make it a 'bad' horn.

TheGoyWonder wrote:This Musica does not appear to have a 45 degree leadpipe entry into the first valve....

http://houston.craigslist.org/msg/4955858046.html

Actually it does, it's just hard to see. The 45° turn is right at the valve casing. All the valves have those fittings on them except the 4th one at the exit.

Only the owner of the tuba can post better pictures. ..

eupher61 wrote:Only the owner of the tuba can post better pictures. ..

Well.... if the OP really wants answers, perhaps they can make the inquiry.

That's a good price- if you're interested, see if you can arrange a play test.

"DP": you're going to punish me for doing homework before asking a question? You're being contrary to the entire online-forum paradigm. It's an specific question about a half-breed tuba, it is interesting to the right person. That's why it doesn't have a click-baity title, only a subject expert or seeker of the same knowledge would click it.

Enters valve at 45 degrees...maybe yes, and maybe every rotor works that way. The leadpipe is not the classic phenotype. I have not studied hard enough to identify based on the braces, that is pushing the limits of my interest but maybe it comes to that. I always did insist on genuine rebuilt Yugoslavian engines for my automobiles.

Even current chinese copies of this instument do not have the club-shaped details, so that's a sign in favor of B&S origin. I asked if the leadpipe had been replaced and to see the backside, if the 4th valve wrap is a match I may just go for it. Owner has been nonresponsive for 3-4 days.

TheGoyWonder wrote:......
Even current chinese copies of this instument do not have the club-shaped details, so that's a sign in favor of B&S origin. I asked if the leadpipe had been replaced and to see the backside, if the 4th valve wrap is a match I may just go for it. Owner has been nonresponsive for 3-4 days.

Guy... this horn has 'club-shaped' details and IS of Chinese origin. As I mentioned before... this does not necessarily mean that it's a 'bad' horn.

bloke wrote:In my experience,

If someone doesn't respond to a craigslist inquiry for several days, that usually means that the thing is...well...sold.

At that price, especially...

TheGoyWonder wrote: This Musica does not appear to have a 45 degree leadpipe entry into the first valve, although the 45 degree exit from 4th valve and the club-shaped details and the outstandingly tall bell are good signs. It's not like you can trust Musica to not slap their name on any old POS, so a verdict is needed on this Musica. At risk of it being poached if it is the real thing.
http://houston.craigslist.org/msg/4955858046.html

The tuba in question looks like a legit VMI 'Musica' to me.


Where to start...

First off, if the tuba says "Musica" on it and also says "Made in Germany", then there is a pretty damn good chance the tuba was made at the VMI (B&S) factory, and is likely an excellent tuba. I see you are still new here.....what do you know about Musica tubas?

AKAIK, the 'Musica' label was used by UMI (now Conn-Selmer) for their imported tubas, at least from the late 90s -- early 2000s. Older 'Musica' tubas I've seen were made with Cerveny/Amati parts. I played a Cerveny 681-parts 'Musica' tuba at my first college. Besides 'Musica' being on the bell, it also said "Steyr, Austria". It was a decent tuba, but the VMI-made Musica tubas I tooted on were even better.

As for the different leadpipe, so what? It just looks like an altered 103 leadpipe put on that model 101. The VMI/B&S factory has used different parts for the horns over the years - the ferrules and bracing is sometimes quite different on some of their old stencils. Some tubas will have flat ferrules with the 'stick' bracing (usually on older stencils). Some will have those smooth-curved ferrules with the "fancier" bracing (more common with later models). Some will have a mix of both. They've been doing this for decades

TheGoyWonder wrote:"DP": you're going to punish me for doing homework before asking a question? You're being contrary to the entire online-forum paradigm. It's an specific question about a half-breed tuba, it is interesting to the right person. That's why it doesn't have a click-baity title, only a subject expert or seeker of the same knowledge would click it.

You haven't been here long, have you, Junior?